sarah.nicastro@ifs.com, Author at Future of Field Service

My hope is by now you’ve heard about our recent announcement of the 2024 Stand Out 50 Leaders and perhaps you’ve even seen that we’ve just published a report we created with the input of those leaders. The idea being that if we’re recognizing the impact of fifty exceptional leaders, it would be worthwhile to use the occasion to understand their views on the service landscape’s current opportunities, challenges, and key areas of focus.

We surveyed the Stand Out 50 to ask them questions we defined across the three categories leaders always say are critical to service transformation: people, process, and technology. I poured over the data and pared it down to fit into the 12-page report myself, but try as I might there was simply too much valuable insight to squeeze it all in. As such, I have some exclusive bits on different topics to share with you all over the coming weeks.

To start, in the people section of the report, we cover a number of factors related to employee engagement. I’m going to assume I don’t need to reinforce the importance of employee engagement; the leaders within the Stand Out 50 and many beyond them realize that to deliver exceptional service and meet business objectives, employee satisfaction not only matters but is crucial. As we explored different aspects of how the Stand Out 50 recruit, hire, retain, and empower their teams, I asked the following (optional) question: What do you feel is the #1 factor that impacts employee engagement? Here are the anecdotal answers that the Stand Out 50 leaders shared:

“Investing in training has and will be a continued priority, including a recent launch of a new training lab that allows for hands-on product training, brand immersion sessions, and focus on soft skills throughout.”

“Creating a culture of humble and transparent leaders through trust and integrity.”

“An effective direct manager that makes them feel valued and supported.”

“Leadership engagement and transparency which enables the employees to connect to the company vision and strategy.”

“Recognition at company level of the importance of the role. Not once a year, but regularly.”

“Being inclusive.”

“Communication - often, timely, candid.”

“Fair, two-way performance reviews linked to training and development.”

“Focus on creating and reinforcing awareness of service relevance to the total business performance.”

“The freedom to have choice in their work life - opportunities, location and working hours, as well as the chance to develop and learn.”

“For service employees, the customer relationships are often what keeps them engaged the most.”

“Promoting work-life balance.”

“Employee empowerment is the basis for engagement.”

“Creating a strong emotional link with the company, feeling part of a family, and having a clear sense of purpose.”

These responses touch on several categories we know to be paramount in today’s talent landscape: empathetic, authentic leadership; clear communication; a sense of purpose; flexibility and work-life balance; investment in ample training and development opportunities; inclusivity; and being recognized and rewarded for their contributions.

I do wonder if, since the Stand Out 50 were peer and team nominated, this acknowledgement of what it takes to create employee engagement is adequately shared among the “masses.” I’ve had a handful of conversations in the last weeks with service leaders who bemoan their organizations failing to recognize the direct tie between how teams are treated and how the business performs, but I do hold a belief the percentage with that mentality is dwindling.

How highly does your organization prioritize employee engagement, and what factor would you add to this list? I’d love to hear from you! Be sure to download the full Stand Out Service Trends Report to see what our leaders had to share about other topics within people as well as process and technology.

Episode 288

In this episode of the Unscripted podcast, host Sarah Nicastro welcomes Michael Galon, Director of North America Service Operations at The Coca-Cola Company, for a conversation about honoring Coca-Cola's rich legacy and embracing innovation in a fast-paced market, as well as staffing challenges, AI, and maintaining service excellence.

Michael is responsible for overall equipment services strategy at Coca-Cola, including installation, repair and project execution for the foodservice and on-premise organization of North America Operating Unit. He leads a high-performing team of 14 Service Operations Managers, Commercialization and Development Managers in the execution of the equipment service strategy through the performance management, alignment and oversight of $300MM spend with over 620 service providers across the United States and Canada.

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Watch the episode here:

Episode Highlights:

Michael - 00:00:00: I like to call it collaborative problem solving. Yeah. Collaborative and creative problem solving. And I think that's really where the wins are. If you leverage your team or you leverage the network, you come up with much better ideas and much better solutions and a much better and easier opportunity to implement those solutions because you got more buy-in, more ownership, more accountability, and everybody feels that they're part of the solution. And I think there's a lot of value in that as well.

Sarah - 00:00:36: Welcome to the Unscripted Podcast. I'm your host, Sarah Nicastro. Today, we are going to be talking about how a company with a deep, rich legacy honors that legacy without leaning too much on it. We're going to do that today with Michael Gallen, who is the Director of North America Service at the Coca-Cola Company. It's a company the listeners might've heard of. Welcome to the podcast, Michael. Just a few, yeah. Yeah, when you talk about brand legacy, Coca-Cola has to be one of the most recognized brands in the world.

Michael - 00:01:25: Absolutely. Yeah. We have a proud tradition and legacy and one of the most recognized trademarks in the world. So it's a very recognizable company and we're great to honor that tradition.

Sarah - 00:01:39: Absolutely. And so the conversation, Michael, that you and I are going to have today, it comes up a lot in my conversations with leaders that are in companies that do have a long legacy, especially one that has been successful, one where they've built a lot of brand recognition. And there's this sort of balance of honoring that legacy and leveraging its strengths without allowing it to become a liability by not keeping pace with innovation, by not being willing to change in areas that it would be helpful to change, etc. So Michael and I were together at Field Service East over the summer, and we were sat down to chat, this topic came up and we decided to have a conversation here on the podcast about it. So thank you for being here. Before we get into the topic, just tell everyone a little bit about yourself, your role, your background, whatever you would like to share.

Michael - 00:02:35: First of all, thanks for having me, Sarah. I appreciate our conversations over the last several months. But my name is Michael Gallen. I lead the service operations team for North America. We support all of the food service customers for Coca-Cola in the United States. And we're responsible for service of those activities or those locations, installations, and project activities. I've been with Coca-Cola for over 25 years now and have been in a number of operations roles with Coca-Cola, both on the customer side, but also on the service operations side. And then prior to Coca-Cola, I had the honor of working with another very recognizable brand, the Golden Arches, with McDonald's, where I worked for a food service distribution company. So I've been very fortunate in my career to work for two very recognizable trademarks between McDonald's. And I've been working for a very recognizable trademarks between McDonald's and Coca-Cola. So excited to chat with you today.

Sarah - 00:03:39: Yeah, thank you for being here. So, all right. Now, there's going to be parts of this conversation that I think leaders, like I said, in any business that has this legacy, but then is looking ahead, is going to be able to resonate with. But there's also some things that make Coca-Cola's business, especially the service business and your service operations, unique. So just so our listeners have some context for that, can you give them a lay of the land before we get into some of the things we want to touch on?

Michael - 00:04:08: Sure. So I work for Coca-Cola North America and around the U.S. We have a number of bottling partners that own the local geographies and support all of the local market customers. And at Coca-Cola North America, we support most of your large chain accounts in the food service area. So what's unique about the way that we go to service to support our customers is we don't have any of our own technicians. We leverage our bottling partners that have technicians on the street servicing their customers to also service our customers. So that's the one thing that makes our profile and our network a little bit unique is that we leverage those bottling partners. But not only the bottling partners, but also we have a large group of smaller independent service providers that also fill in the gaps if you will, where sometimes our bottling partners can't get to all of our customers very timely, or if there's a specialized project where we need to leverage a specialized skill set, we have a very broad network that we can plug and play different providers into different activities to make sure that we're supporting our customers in the manner that they need supported, whether it be reactive service, specialized service, installation, project activities, those types of things. So it's become very strategic in how we go to business. After COVID, post-COVID, there's a lot of challenges that have faced the workforce, and we've had to be very flexible on how we support our customers. Where prior to COVID, most of the activities were funneled through our bottling network. And now we've had to flex in different markets where we've had some capacity challenge, some hiring challenges, some retention but we feel we're very well positioned in how we've flexed and added different service providers to our network to, again, make sure that we've got the right service capabilities and capacity to support our customers.

Sarah - 00:06:21: Mm-hmm. Okay. That makes sense. So if I'm understanding correctly, the bottlers are exclusively Coca-Cola partners. And the independent service providers may or may not be working with other companies, but you're leveraging them to fill in, whether it's capacity or skills, to augment the support you have from your bottling partners. Did I understand that correctly? Okay.

Michael - 00:06:47: Yes. And most of our bottlers have a geography, a number of states that they support. So they're regionally scattered throughout the U.S. And then we have some large national providers that we leverage to support us with some national projects.

Sarah - 00:07:02: Mm-hmm.

Michael - 00:07:03: There are company such as IC that has a specialize skill set in frozen beverage and we do the same with coffee as well, where we leverage some specialized service providers in those particular areas that are more specialized based on the equipment that the customer may have in that particular outlet.

Sarah - 00:07:23: Okay. All right. That makes sense. It actually makes me think of a podcast we did a while back. I don't remember the number off the top of my head, but we can put it into the show notes with Whirlpool. And they, a number of years back, made a decision strategically as a business to only go to market and service through their partner network. And we had a really interesting conversation about what that looks like, but also some of the strengths of that model, which it sounds similar to your thinking. Now, That being said, particularly when we're talking about what we're talking about today, this idea of like legacy versus potential liability, it can also complicate things, right? So it can be both, right? And it's just something that as we talk through things today, listeners should keep in mind that is how you go to market from a service perspective. So

Michael - 00:08:16: attending several of the events where we've bumped into each other, I get a lot of questions about our independent and third party service network from companies that have their own technicians. And they're trying to identify how do I augment our current service network with adding potential third parties into our network where maybe they do have their own technicians as company techs. But they're looking to fill in some of the gaps with a third party network. So a lot of folks now post-COVID are looking at more of maybe a hybrid model.

Sarah - 00:08:54: Yeah, absolutely. And it was interesting what stands out in my mind from the episode with Whirlpool is I asked a question around one of the most common concerns of working with any third party service providers, which is. How do you maintain control of the customer experience, the brand experience? And the woman that answered the question said, maybe the issue is trying to have control versus looking at it as a partnership. And it just made me think about what that relationship can be like. And if you focus on the mutual benefit, right, between your regional partners or even your national partners and yourselves, and figure out what works to maximize the mutual benefit, it doesn't have to be this contentious. Tug-of-war type relationship that I think a lot of people still have in their minds when they're probably asking you some of how does it work? How do you do this? How do you keep track of this? So yeah, very interesting, but not what we're here to talk about today. Okay. So as I mentioned in the introduction, when we were together at Field Service East, we sat down and we were just chatting about some of the, I don't want to say pros and cons, but strengths and considerations is the way I would put it, right? Because on one hand when you have a brand with a strong legacy and particularly one that has been successful, there's another side of this conversation for brands that have a legacy, but maybe have a tarnished reputation or haven't had ongoing success, et cetera. This is not the case here, right? So you have this pool of benefit and resource that you want to fully leverage. On the other hand, legacy lends itself to having a lot of practice figuring out what works and streamlining operations and getting things the way you want them, which sometimes can cause resistance to or hesitation to change significantly, which can be challenging, right? So this was the premise of what we chatted about. And as I said to you then and earlier, This is a very common tightrope to walk, right? This is something that I think I could probably name 10 companies off the top of my head that I've had this sort of same conversation with. So to get your perspective and your input on this, first, I want to talk about some of the ways that for Coca-Cola and for probably others, the legacy that you have can be a big advantage to the business and to service specifically. Okay. So I'm just going to mention some of the things that we talked through. The first is brand recognition. So from a service standpoint, how do you feel like that is helpful for you to leverage when you're thinking about the continued service success for the organization.

Michael - 00:12:03: I think the brand recognition gives us a point of entry when our sales folks are in there selling. We do have what we feel are the best brands, the best offering of a beverage portfolio for our customers. We also believe that we have some of the best marketing that's out there. But at the end of the day, if we don't have equipment that is up and operating and helping that operator, that food service operator, making profits and selling beverages, then the best brands in the world and the best marketing are going to fall flat. So we've got to make sure that we've got the right resources to support our operational capability, of which services is one of those pillars, to make sure that we're delivering every single day against what we try to add to our customers, that we can bring you more value as the Coca-Cola company with our bundle. Right. You mentioned brands and marketing and service and equipment and innovation and our distribution network and all those things that help lift up those brands and that marketing so that we are one of the most recognized brands in the world. But more importantly, I think it's that foundation, those foundational. Pillars that really help lift up the brand and the marketing so that we are out there selling each and every day. And it gives us that competitive advantage when it comes to adding more customers to our portfolio, especially in the food service business that we feel is our competitive advantage. But with that comes great privilege to work for Coca-Cola, but also great responsibility to make sure that we're delivering against our promise to our customers around service.

Sarah - 00:13:55: Yeah. Now you talked about service being. The aspect of the relationship or the aspect of the, yeah, the customer experience that really upholds that relationship. And so thinking about what you just said, the brand recognition is great as an entry point, as you mentioned, right? But if you go in with this great brand, these great pitches, sales decks, equipment, innovation, and then something breaks and no one comes to fix it in a timely manner or fix it well, etc. You're not going to be able to uphold that brand recognition. So that's where service comes in. How would you say, what does that look like in terms of that focus on relationship building? And how do you see that as a strength that your legacy has allowed you to sort of play up.

Michael - 00:14:47: So when it comes to the customer side of the business, we have a dedicated team focused against operational support for each one of our large North America customers. On the other side of the fence, which is where I play, we have service operations managers that are dedicated to our service providers. So we've got a relationship with our customer from an operations perspective our team is leveraging our relationship with our service providers. And then that customer ops manager, along with the service ops manager, is really connecting and collaborating on any of those type of opportunities that we might have with a particular customer, whether it's a service escalation, whether it's a new project or brand expansion, or maybe we've just landed a customer and we're working on a conversion program. But the relationship that we have with our customers, with our service network is really foundational, but it's also very collaborative. At the end of the day, we all want to win more customers, but we also want to serve those customers. And the better off our customers are serving our beverages, the more profitable they are, the more profitable we are. We believe that value bundle that we bring to them every day is really what sets us apart.

Sarah - 00:16:16: Yeah. So the way you described it, there's this well-working operating model in place where you maintain some level of interaction with customers directly. But your team specifically is focused on supporting the service partners that you have that are the ones executing on the service for those customers in a way that I know you described is kind of like a well-oiled machine, right? And has allowed you to, you said, consistently over-deliver on service. So can you explain what you mean by that?

Michael - 00:16:51: Yeah, so when it comes to over-delivering on service and service execution, we feel that we invest in class service performance when it comes to our metrics around completion time, fix right first visit, equipment uptime. You think about cost, quality, and speed, those core foundational metrics that we run our business by, we believe we're best in class. But the validation for that is really what we hear from our customers as well. A lot of times we're compared to other providers that are coming in to a restaurant, whether it be plumbing or food service or other service companies that come into those outlets. And we continue to hear that we are delivering world-class, best-class, however you want to phrase it, service levels. And that's really what we continue to focus on with our service partners is maintaining that competitive advantage when it comes to performance around those core deliverables. And more so now than ever with the pressures that are on staffing and food service establishments, more so than ever, they want us to respond quickly, but they also want us to have the right part and get them back up and pouring. The other shift that's happened post-COVID is more business is going through the drive-through now than ever. So that operation of the equipment in the drive-through is more important than ever. And we need to make sure if 90% of their business is going through the drive-through, that we have that equipment up and running when they need it so that they can continue to make profits from our beverage. But when they succeed, we succeed as well.

Sarah - 00:18:42: And that was the final piece I want to talk about. You just mentioned in passing there, which is. The role of having really strong marketing support because I'm sure that's applicable in a number of different ways, but it's also possible because of the success and the legacy of the brand, right? There are a lot of companies that are newer entrants to the market, not in your space, but just in general, or they are, you know, historically focused elsewhere, and now they're focused on growing service that don't have a lot of that support, at least to start, and that can be challenging. So you have that. What I wanted to point out is, again, that the way that collaboration takes place, but also how much of that is focused on insights that help both Coca-Cola and your service partners and your customers understand. Consumption, usage, trends, right? So that was one of the things we talked about. And I think that's really important to mention because those insights are very valuable to all three of those parties involved. Yeah. And that's just, it's a I think it sounds like it's a pretty sophisticated function that not everyone has. So that's why I just wanted to make sure we touched on that in the sort of strengths category.

Michael - 00:20:07: Yeah. If you think about the freestyle equipment that we have, that offers over 100 different beverages. And that really leverages the insights that you mentioned from consumers, right? So now we're able to provide a huge offering of different beverages. And based on consumption and usage at different concepts, we can create different marketing programs that are individual to either a chain location. We're able to create a customized beverage for the demographic that may be going into that particular establishment. Or on the flip side, if we see a particular blend of beverage, a particular recipe that consumers are dispensing from the freestyle. We've actually gone ahead and produced a bottle can package to have that available in a prepackaged form because that's what customers are wanting. So that piece of equipment has been huge for us from a marketing asset, a beverage innovation lab, if you will, in many of our customer outlets. But the other thing is it provides the consumer so many more options now than just your traditional eight head, eight valve fountain dispenser. So we've really leveraged that equipment platform in many different ways, but definitely on the consumption side and the insight side. And then leverage that with our customers.

Sarah - 00:21:41: Yeah. Okay, so these are all great things. And I want to shift gears and talk about some of the aspects where there could be question marks of, okay, like, and this isn't, there's no, to be clear to the listeners, these are not questions we have answers to. It's not like you're saying definitively, I think this is a risk, or I think this is an area of concern. It's more so. I think this healthy exercise of when you're in a company that has this type of legacy and has things working well to be asking these questions so they aren't just in the flow and not thinking about it. Because I think what we're really talking about here is there's areas where I'm sure you could revisit. You said you want to maintain the competitive advantage that you have through your service. So what that brings to mind for me is this idea of incremental improvement to maintain this success that you have. I think where the questions come in more is when we start to think about more disruptive innovation, right? Because that's where you get into not just tweaking or incrementally improving what's already working, but where you start to reflect on, okay, are there areas where we should make a more wholesale change and what would that look like? And I think those are important questions for anyone in any business, but particularly a business with a deep legacy to be asking. So one of the things you said is the business model has essentially been the same for 20 plus years, and it works really well. And I think that in and of itself is the potential challenge, right? Because when you have something that is a well-oiled machine, the inclination is never going to be to change it up or to try something completely different. But we know that at times that type of disruptive innovation can be valuable. So how do you sort of look at this question and reflect on how much you maintain that success versus how much you consider? When it might be time to do something more disruptive or different.

Michael - 00:24:01: Yeah, I think that's a great question. And it's a challenging opportunity, right? When you look at the way our service network is set up, because we have 11 large franchise bottlers, if you will, then we have another collection of smaller bottlers that have smaller territories, and then our independent network. And when you talk about something disruptive to the service organization, that's a lot of different entities that you've got to gain buy-in, but also develop a collaborative plan to get folks on board, which presents its own challenges. But one of the things that I think we try to do here at Coca-Cola is not those major disruptive activities, like that we need to revamp something totally, but what are the small components within different processes, different functions that we can make improvements. One of the areas that we're focusing on right now is AI, right? How can we use AI to improve the service that we provide to our customers ultimately? But also, how can we use it to support our service network? Our service network is facing many challenges when it comes to staffing. No longer do we have a very seasoned workforce. We've got a very green workforce, a lot of newer technicians. And one of the things that we're trying to leverage AI is to be able to provide that training information, that training on the job, if you will, through AI, whether it be a search by the technician when they're on site or providing predictive information based on customer equipment, service history, parts usage. We're able to take that data and then provide information to the technician to say, based on all of these factors, these are the most likely parts that are needed. And this is the troubleshooting steps needed to be taken to get that customer back up and running. And we're trying to do small disruptions in different areas so that we can continue to move the needle and move that big ship of over 600 different service providers to improve our service level to our customers.

Sarah - 00:26:31: Yeah. I think that makes sense. And I think reflecting on the way the business is structured, and you mentioned that your team specifically is supporting the partners that are delivering service. So I guess I'm thinking about two things. I think what you just described makes perfect sense. It isn't an area of complacency. It's an area of strategic continuous improvement, right? I think where the opportunities for more disruptive change could come from would be the direct line to the customers. I would always argue that is the best source of insight to indicate that there needs to be a bigger change, right?

Michael - 00:27:16: Sure.

Sarah - 00:27:16: And I think ultimately, if you have service execution that is consistently overachieving your set standards and you have high customer satisfaction. There isn't really an argument for disruption unless the company as a whole started to look at shifting the business model, right? Which is a completely different conversation. But if you were to start to hear from customers, like we would rather just pay a monthly subscription and that sort of thing. That being said, that's not gonna be a decision that takes place in your department specifically because you're focused on supporting the execution of the service model that's already in place, if that makes sense. But I think those are some of the things that it's really more making sure that you are maintaining that. Interaction with customers so that you start to sense, okay, maybe there would be benefit in doing this thing we haven't done before. So yeah, that makes sense.

Michael - 00:28:16: And we're hearing a little bit of that, Sarah. When I talked about comparing us to other companies, there are other companies that do really good work and have really good performance levels. And they're doing things that are innovative because they're a smaller company and they can change quicker and they can try things and it fails and then they can try something different. But some of the things that we hear from customers is we would need a higher level of service, right? Is there a better best? Is there a particular service level that from a response time perspective that you would guarantee service and things of those natures? And I think there's certainly an opportunity for that. I don't think it's widespread at this point. And the other thing I would say is because our metrics are relatively high in most of those categories, there's not a significant need for it. But when we are compared against other providers, those are some of the types of things that do come up. From a disruption perspective, that would definitely be disruptive. But the other thing I think of is it would also be an opportunity for potentially a revenue opportunity that we could charge more for that particular service level than what we're doing today. Because right now we're cost recovery, we're cost neutral, for the most part, against all the different categories for service, whether it be service execution, install parts, our own training department that we use to help train technicians in the field. All of that is pretty much cost neutral. And our customers don't necessarily feel the expense when it comes to service.

Sarah - 00:30:04: Yeah, that makes sense. And I agree. I think that that's a whole business model conversation, not a service delivery model conversation. And if you, as long as you're listening and understanding, like you said, is this getting more widespread? Should we think about what this could look like? Yeah, that makes sense. What about, we talked a little bit about this. You mentioned from a service provider perspective, it's become harder to staff, less experience, et cetera. Is there anything you kind of reflect on that maybe needs to change in how you work with those, providers as a result of the talent landscape as it is today?

Michael - 00:30:48: Yeah, as I mentioned earlier, we've added over 60 new providers into the service network just to fill in those gaps of where we have providers that are struggling with either hiring or retention, or maybe technicians were furloughed during COVID and they've had a hard time bringing technicians back. So we've had to be very strategic post-COVID to build our network so that we have the right capacity, the right capability to service our customers' needs. And that's probably the biggest challenge for us. Because our model is a little bit different, right? When it comes to our cost structure and labor rates and what we pay service providers, it's a little different, right? We're not necessarily paying service providers the street rate. And therefore, that can become a little bit challenging when you're trying to bring new people into the network. If there's a difference in what they're able to charge their customers versus what I may be paying them for service. But there's also a lot of other benefits that come with having Coca-Cola as part of their service portfolio. So there's definitely a balance there. But I would say that's the biggest challenge for us is making sure that we have the right providers providing the right service for our customers. And we still have markets where we challenge. We have challenges, to be quite honest with you. And we're still looking to expand and or help other companies expand into new geographies and stand up technicians in different areas.

Sarah - 00:32:32: Yeah.

Michael - 00:32:32: But that's harder to do. It's obviously much easier to find a company that has techs in bands with parts in bands and be able to add our service on top of that.

Sarah - 00:32:44: Yeah.

Michael - 00:32:45: There's a mutual benefit versus asking someone to go to a new geography and try to stand up from ground zero. So,

Sarah - 00:32:51: yeah.

Michael - 00:32:52: That's our biggest challenge.

Sarah - 00:32:54: Yeah, which then brings us back to the point you made earlier about another area of continued reflection on change is where can we add in technology to help alleviate some of that burden? So you obviously aren't going to introduce AI to the extent that you don't need those technicians. But if you can do so in a way that helps support technicians that don't have the same level of experience or are newer to service or newer to this industry, it just helps take a little bit of that pressure off, which makes sense.

Michael - 00:33:27: The other area where we try to reduce the calls that are going into the field is we have probably over 80 in-house senior technicians, call them the my co-techs, that are able to support our customers over the phone and or our field technicians where they need support, trying to reduce that. That truck roll by supporting customers over the phone and making sure that we can get their equipment back up and running, or if it's what we call a nuisance call and some we can ship out a small part and have them back up and running a lot quicker, that benefits everybody in the system and eliminates a truck roll. And therefore, we're trying to take calls out of the system, especially where we have capacity concerns.

Sarah - 00:34:12: Yeah, that makes sense. So talking about all of this. We get back to this fundamental question of how much do you agree with the mentality of if it ain't broke, don't fix it or not. So. Where do you feel you land on finding that right balance?

Michael - 00:34:35: So that's a great question. I think there's always an opportunity for continuous improvement. Even if you're delivering the metrics, there's also always underlying contributing factors, some low hanging fruit that you can take out of your process. One of the areas where we continue to have opportunity with customers and service providers is what we call dry runs, right? So if you're thinking about an install at a new location and we go to the location, we dispatch an install team, we have equipment on the truck, and we get there. And for whatever reason, that customer is truly not ready for an installation. And I think that's an example where there's little opportunities within different aspects of our business and how we can continue to approve and take costs out of the system, but also make that those technicians more productive. That ownership is on us, not the service providers, because we're ultimately paying them to show up there. But that's an area where we've got a lot of focus. It's a frustration point for our service network. It adds additional costs to the system. But I think if you ever get complacent in what you're delivering and trying to keep in touch with what the customer is looking for, that's where you start to fall behind. I don't want to say we did that, but I feel we got stagnant for a little bit. And now we're back on track to making sure that we've got a competitive advantage and that we're delivering against our customers' needs and expectations and adding value for our customers, which is most important for them. But again, when they win, we win. And we want to be their best partner in helping them grow their business. And when they grow their business, we grow our business.

Sarah - 00:36:31: Yeah, I think there's so much benefit in the practice of just asking yourself these questions, right? You don't have to have all of the answers, but reflecting on these things, like you said, looking for, okay, we just did this. What's the next pain point we can address? What's the next problem we can solve? What's the next? Area of value we can explore, right? Like just slow and steady going after what's the next thing, what's the next thing instead of just getting comfortable, I think is the difference that we're talking about. I recently did a podcast with Tim Spencer and he talked about that idea of the way that he's introduced a lot of innovation into the different companies he's worked in is just by constantly asking that question. Okay, we solved that problem. What's the next problem? What's the next pain point? What's the next problem? And if the solution is incremental. That's where it will lead you. If the solution requires something bigger or more, that's where it will lead you. But no one needs to disrupt just for the sake of disruption. It's just about constantly asking the questions of what do our customers need? What do our service providers need? What do we need to do next? What problem is there to solve next? That will get you where you need to go.

Michael - 00:37:50: Sure.

Sarah - 00:37:51: Yeah.

Michael - 00:37:51: And the other thing I think, and I think Tim mentioned it in his podcast, right, is that he doesn't have all the answers. I don't have. We've got a vast network of folks that have been in this service business for a very long time, a lot of successful independent service providers that have leadership in this food service space. How do we leverage those collective ideas and collaborate so that we're creating the best solutions and it's not one person that comes up with an idea and tries to force it into the system where it maybe doesn't fit, but more of that collaborative approach. I like to call it collaborative problem solving.

Sarah - 00:38:35: Yeah.

Michael - 00:38:36: Collaborative and creative problem solving. And I think that's really where the wins are. You leverage your team or you leverage the network, you come up with much better ideas and much better solutions. And a much better and easier opportunity to implement those solutions because you got more buy-in, more ownership, more accountability, and everybody feels that they're part of the solution. And I think there's a lot of value in that as well.

Sarah - 00:39:02: Absolutely. Makes sense. Michael, in your 25 years at Coca-Cola, what would you say is the biggest lesson you've learned?

Michael - 00:39:11: I think the the biggest lesson that I've learned in 25 years at Coca-Cola has really been about learning from other people and asking a lot of questions and having that ability to want to learn, but also leveraging relationships. We feel that we've got a lot of great people that work at Coca-Cola and leveraging those relationships has really, it's been humbling for me but it's also been something that has helped me in my career is being true to who you are, wanting to learn and then building your own relationships with other people and then trying to pass those things along to the next generation. So I'm excited about what I've learned, where we're at today, where I think we're going, the support of our service network and our bottling partners. So it's been a real privilege for me to be at Coca-Cola for over 25 years, but relationship building and collaboration, I would say would be the biggest thing that I really value about working at Coca-Cola.

Sarah - 00:40:20: Yeah, I always say, especially in this day and age, when you talk to someone who's been with a company for 10 years, 15 years, 20 years, 25 years, that it's a good organization that has given them opportunities to learn and grow and feel fulfilled. Otherwise, people don't stay in one place that long anymore. So I think that's great. Really appreciate you coming on, Michael, and sharing your thoughts and your perspective with us. So thank you very much.

Michael - 00:40:50: Thank you, sir. I appreciate it.

Sarah - 00:40:52: You can find more by visiting the home of the Unscripted podcast at https://futureoffieldservice.com. We will put in the show notes the links to the Whirlpool episode that I referenced, as well as the episode with Tim Spencer. So keep an eye out for those. The podcast is published in partnership with IFS. You can learn more at futureoffieldservice.com. As always, thank you for listening.

Last week, more than 2,000 customers, partners, and prospects from across the globe descended upon the Orlando World Center Marriott (which happens to be the largest Marriott in the world) for IFS Unleashed. It was an action-packed week (and that’s putting it lightly!) with more to recap than could possibly fit into one short article. So here I’ll share my top five moments of the week.

#1: The Future of Field Service Stand Out 50 Leadership Awards Announcement

These aren’t even in a particular order, but of course this had to be number one! This summer, we opened nominations for the Stand Out 50 leadership awards, on a quest to acknowledge not only the incredible work of service leaders, but to reinforce the tremendous importance, value, and potential of service within businesses. On Wednesday, we announced the winners live at the event. I was joined by two of my fellow judges, Dot Mynahan of National Elevator Industry, Inc. and John Carroll, CEO of the Service Council, who spoke with me about why this recognition matters so much. It was an honor to have the opportunity to acknowledge these impactful leaders, some of which were able to join us live for the award. Take a moment to have a look at the winners and stay tuned for some content we’ve collaborated with them on as well.

#2: Mark Moffat’s Opening Keynote

Mark took the reigns as CEO from Darren Roos in January, and it was compelling to see how he addressed the crowd on opening day. His keynote brought what felt like genuine energy and passion around the next phases of IFS’s journey that he’s signed up to lead. He set the stage for Industrial AI as the next Industrial Revolution and spoke enthusiastically about how IFS is positioned to lead as that unfolds. The session set the tone of high energy and excitement for the week! You can watch his keynote here.

#3: Darren Roos’s Closing Interview with Gary Player

I’ve never golfed a day in my life, so while I knew who Gary Player is, I didn’t expect this session to have a markable impact on me. About three minutes in, I found my eyes welling up with tears listening to the 89-year-old legend talk about what’s mattered most in his life, how he takes care of himself, and some of the incredible experiences he’s had. As a bonus, I ran into him in the hallway just after and he was kind as could be – gave me a big hug, a kiss on each cheek, and gladly took a selfie. I won’t be picking up golf clubs as a result, but the interview is one that will stick with me for a long time.

#4: Exelon’s Story of Business-Led Digital Transformation

There were many impressive customer stories shared over the three-day event, so while it’s hard to pick just one, I’ll explain why Exelon’s took the top spot for me. The company’s leaders spoke about the importance of not only replacing outdated technology, but doing so in a business-led, customer-centric manner. To me, this means modernizing the right way – not just layering new technology on top of existing processes but digging in to see what all it will take to become the business it wants to be not only today but into the future.

#5: Making Memories with Wonderful People

I will own that this is a cheat to put on this list, because it isn’t *one* moment but a whole lot of them. But if there’s a true number one, it’s this one – because having the opportunity to spend time in person is a gift. There’s simply no replacement for human connection, and having the chance to share a laugh, give a hug, have a brainstorm session, shake hands, ride a roller coaster (we went to Universal Studios Wednesday night, which was so fun!), or even just smile at across the room are moments that make the hard work we all go back and do different, because we’ve connected (or reconnected) on that human level. It’s special, and it’s an important reminder that it’s always people that matter most.

Episode 287

In this episode of the Unscripted podcast, host Sarah Nicastro reveals the 1st edition of the Future of Field Service Standout 50 Leaders, celebrating exceptional service leaders who drive innovation and customer-centric strategies in the industry. Sarah highlights the evolving service delivery landscape and the crucial and often behind-the-scenes roles these leaders play in motivating teams and navigating modern business challenges. With insights from a panel of industry experts, she discusses the critical traits of the Standout 50. She announces an upcoming report featuring valuable data on people, processes, and technology in the service sector. Join Sarah as she recognizes these impactful leaders and shares how to stay updated on their findings!

Sarah Nicastro is a passionate advocate for the power of human connection and service evolution. Since 2008 she first stumbled into the field service industry, she has been captivated by the transformation of service from a cost center to a strategic driver of innovation and growth. Through meaningful conversations with business leaders, Sarah uncovers insights that inspire and inform others. Her mission is to prove that it’s possible to love family, work, and the world simultaneously while building a community that shares knowledge, forms lasting relationships and creates a positive impact.

If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe, rate, and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.

Episode Highlights:

Sarah - 00:00:00: It brings me great pleasure to announce this list today because I care so much about this community and have such a deep respect for the hard work that service leaders are doing to impact their teams, their customers, and to bring their businesses and the industry as a whole forward. The thing about service is it's most effective when it isn't seen or heard, when it happens seamlessly and invisibly. This creates a challenge because there's a tremendous amount of work that goes into service. And it's not only incredibly important, but it quite literally keeps the world running. However, it's something that often goes unrecognized.

Welcome to the UNSCRIPTED Podcast. I'm your host, Sarah Nicastro. Today is a very exciting day because we are announcing the first ever Future of Field Service Standout 50 Leaders. That was a mouthful. This is an award that we created to be able to recognize and acknowledge some of the hard work that leaders within our community and the broader service community are doing. It brings me great pleasure to announce this list today because I care so much about this community and have such a deep respect for the hard work that service leaders are doing to impact their teams, their customers, and to bring their businesses and the industry as a whole forward. The thing about service is it's most effective when it isn't seen or heard, when it happens seamlessly and invisibly. This creates a challenge because there's a tremendous amount of work that goes into service. And it's not only incredibly important, but it quite literally keeps the world running. However, it's something that often goes unrecognized.

With the power of today's technologies, companies are evolving how they offer service. They're moving beyond transactional and break-fix service models to be more customer-centric, to deliver outcomes-based service and create new revenue streams and change their business models. As the possibilities of how to serve customers vastly expands, so too does what service can mean to the business. It's a key brand experience. It's a powerful competitive differentiator. It can be a substantial growth opportunity and so much more. While it is an exciting time for service, It also signifies an immense amount of change. Some companies are enthusiastic about the opportunity this presents, and others are still working to determine exactly what role service plays in their broader business landscape. This means that the role of today's service leader is tremendously complex. It means balancing the need to meet the demands of today's business while working toward creating the business of the future. It requires a deep customer understanding, the ability to attract and motivate talent, the creativity to innovate, but also the patience to manage change, and the need to balance initiatives for both the short-term and the long-term, all while advocating for the importance and the role of service within their businesses.

So these leaders do a whole lot. We see that firsthand in all of the conversations that we're fortunate to have here on this on this podcast, the folks were able to meet at the Future of Field Service live events. And as I said, I've been in one form or another engaging with this community for more than 16 years and care a lot about making sure that the hard work these folks are doing is acknowledged and recognized. One of the ways that we decided to do that this year was launching this Standout 50 Leadership Initiative. We held open nominations in June and July on the Future of Field Service website, and the leaders were nominated by colleagues, by peers, by industry connections, etc. We had a panel of judges that included myself, Dot Minahan, who spent over 30 years with Otis Elevator and now is with the National Elevator Industry, John Carroll, who heads the Service Council, and Professor Tim Baines, who heads the Advanced Services Group at Aston Business School in the UK. So the four of us came together and sifted through all of the nominations and did the hard work of landing on the 50 leaders, that we are announcing today as the Standout 50. There's, of course, not enough time to touch on all of the incredible traits that were brought up when we read through the nominations for these leaders and those that ultimately weren't selected. But just to share a couple of examples, these individuals, they don't sacrifice innovation to meet immediate needs. So this is, of course, a balancing act. But we need leaders in roles today that are not just completely caught up in what the next immediate need is. They're also finding ways to carve out time, energy, resource, and building teams that are able to also think about what will make the business successful in the future. They evangelize the importance of service within their businesses. As I mentioned earlier, service is often most appreciated when it is invisible. And this is true from a customer perspective. The less friction, the more, seamless peace of mind you can provide, the better. But also within organizations, often service, particularly frontline resources, aren't recognized and acknowledged the way that other functions of the business are. Service leaders play this important role of making sure the business understands the potential of service and what it can represent, but also the incredible impact of its teams and the critical role that they play in what the business does. They're bold. They're not afraid to speak out on topics and issues that are relevant and important today. They aren't afraid to think outside of the box. They aren't protecting the status quo at all costs. They look for ways to think differently, to be creative, to ask questions, and to be curious. They put their teams first because they care and because they know that doing so will create the best customer experience. I'll share a bit later an initiative we have worked on with the leaders who were awarded the Standout 50 award. And we talked with them about employee engagement and not only its importance, but what factors they think are critical in building a good culture and having engaged employees and just thinking through some of the responses and the anecdotes that were shared, it's clear how much these leaders value their teams as human beings and as an important part in the success of their function and their businesses. They prioritize customer intimacy. I think standout service leaders understand that the best source of inspiration for innovation comes from customers themselves and understanding, their businesses deeply, understanding what matters to them, understanding what their challenges are, what their opportunities are. And they make sure that this is a priority for them and their teams. They harness the power of modern technology. They understand that it's critical to work smarter versus harder today. In fact, it's likely impossible to keep pace if you are trying to just work hard enough to evolve without really creating a solid strategy around leveraging, things like AI and automation to streamline operations. And to look for ways to change service delivery and evolve, the customer value proposition. They focus on creating inclusive environments, they are not interested in diversity as checkbox exercise. But rather, they truly value, having a range of experiences skills opinions perspectives, and they know that doing so and giving those people a safe space to contribute and making sure everyone feels part of the, not only the team, but the broader business objectives is the best way to succeed. They're authentic, they're humble, and they are continually learning and growing. These are folks that are willing to reflect on what's working and what isn't, even within their own leadership styles. They are engaging with peers and with the broader service community to understand best practices and trends. They're listening to their teams, and they're seeking to understand, and they are not being complacent, not only within their business, but within themselves.

So those are just a few things that I think, are notable about standout service leaders today and are standout 50. So I'm not going to take the time here to read all 50 names aloud, because I think that would probably be the point in this podcast where people log off, but we will make sure that we insert the graphic with all 50 leaders on the page for this podcast on our website. If you're listening to this on a podcast platform, you can simply visit futureoffieldservice.com. And take a look at the standout 50 leaders. As we make the official announcement today, I just wanted to take this time here on the podcast to reflect on why we created this initiative. Also to thank the future of field service team. This initiative created a lot of extra work on top of our regular content to fit in. And we took that on gladly because we are honored to be able to have a way to, recognize these folks, but the team does deserve a huge thank you. And most importantly, to congratulate the leaders who were recognized as well as all who were nominated for their amazing impact. So please join me in congratulating the first ever Future of Field Service Standout 50 for work well done. I also wanted to share, as I alluded to earlier, that we have taken the opportunity to work with the Standout 50 on a report where we are compiling some of their insights.

So I wanted to sort of take this moment in time to not only acknowledge and recognize these leaders, but also to share some of their perspectives with our audience. I think it's really interesting to sort of try and peek inside of the minds of leaders who were nominated as Standout, as special by their peers and by their colleagues to see what their thoughts are on some of the biggest trends and themes and challenges today. So we created this report in three parts, people, process, and technology, because over the years, as I've interviewed leaders on service transformation, those are sort of the three pillars, that people commonly refer to as critical in that journey. So we took the opportunity to put together a survey in each of those categories. So with some questions around themes related to people, to process, to technology, participation in the survey was optional. So leaders aren't being named in terms of who contributed or what quotes came from which individual. It was optional and anonymous so that they felt they could share honestly, but we've compiled their insights, both the results of the survey from a quantitative perspective, but also anecdotally and reflected some of our own opinions on what we found and what came out of that was interesting to myself and what I think might be interesting to you all and the broader community. So it's a report that will be up on the website in the next week or so. So please keep an eye out for that. And we will certainly be sharing on our social media when. It's finalized and when it's published, there was so much great content that it was impossible to fit it all into that report. So I will also be doing a series of articles for Future of Field Service, with some of the anecdotes and insights that didn't fit into the full length report. So keep an eye out for those as well.

Once again, huge congratulations to the Standout 50. I am honored to be able to recognize each of you and the effort that you put in. But also the people you are. So congratulations. And please visit futureoffieldservice.com to see the full list of the Standout 50 and also to keep an eye out for the research piece that will be coming out in the next week or so. You can find all of that and more at futureoffieldservice.com. Also, be sure if you aren't already to follow us on LinkedIn. The podcast is published in partnership with IFS. You can learn more at ifs.com. As always. Thank you for listening.

Everyone has heard and likely used the term “master the basics.” In the service context, we often do so when talking about the need to have the fundamentals nailed before looking to innovate. I recently hosted a podcast with Ben Williams, Director of Service Operations for Americas at 3D Systems, that made me reflect on our use of this term.

When Ben and I had our podcast prep call to explore different ideas for our discussion, he brought up the importance of “being brilliant on the basics” before trying to layer on change. This became the theme for his episode, during which I realized the distinction between the two phrases. “Being brilliant on the basics is important because you create a solid operational foundation, which aligns you for a long-term growth and sustainability. And the byproduct of that is increasing your customer experience,” he says.

The difference between Ben’s suggestion of being brilliant on the basics versus the more commonly used phrasing of mastering the basics comes down to the fact that the service landscape of today is something that is in many ways a moving target – and how could you master what continues to change? You can’t, so as Ben suggests, you focus on being brilliant on the basics – continuously, as what it takes to be brilliant in any given area of service will change.

“You're going to get to a point where you’re brilliant on the basics and your customer experience is great. And then you reach this spot called Arte. Right. Once you reach that, that's the mastery of everything. But the problem is, personnel changes, process changes, and then you're beginning back at the basics. It's kind of like an ebb and flow, just like the tide. It's constant work in progress. And do you master it? No, I don't believe there's a real mastery of it, but I do believe that you'll get to a point where the change part, the willingness to change, look at your processes, wanting to keep building on your future becomes more innate,” Ben shares.

Wise words! I really liked this reframing of a term we’ve used often, perhaps without fully reflecting on what it means. So rather than focusing on mastering the basics, the win seems to be in mastering the willingness and ability to continually learn and evolve.

Ben and I went on to discuss some of the areas within his remit where he’s focused on being brilliant on the basics. These are areas we’d know to be fundamental to any service operation, but with layers of change continually being introduced as a result of technological innovation, customer preferences, and so on. Here’s a look at what was on Ben’s list:

Customer Communication – this category encompasses a range of things, from understanding how customers want to communicate with you (what channels) to ensuring everyone from your frontline workforce up is adept at communication skills. Ben says, “If it's something that's important, people forget: pick up the phone and call. If you're in an escalated issue or process, communicate. Don't hold secrets. Communicate. Foundational things that leaders may know, but we're in a different time now. You have to teach these things.” And going back to the moving target theme, it’s important to stay connected to what your customer preferences are and what experiences they value and continue to focus on being brilliant at those things.
Process Optimization – reflecting on processes and whether or not they serve the business and its customers is a practice that must be ongoing, because what works at one point in time won’t necessarily work a year from now. Because this exercise is one that forces companies to introduce change to their frontline employees, I feel it’s put off or avoided more than it should be. Ben shares, “I think everyone would agree it's cheaper to optimize than to spend. Where we run into issues is your old process might not be able to handle all the new optimization and efficiencies you want. The processes were probably great for 2000 or 2018. But in 2024, you might have to revisit some of these processes. Everybody has a different cadence, right? For me and our business, we review processes probably every year to ensure and it'll help us where we're at, where we've come from, and which direction we want to go forward.”
Strategic Alignment – this encompasses everything from the fact that your customers see you as one brand versus separate functions to the need to create a common view on what the potential for service is for the business and the risk of inefficiency. Ben says, “The customer sees 3D Systems. They don't see 3D Systems field service, customer service, and accounts payable. They see 3D Systems as a team, and being strategically aligned and eliminating silos is one of the best things you can do as a company.”
Leadership – with an evolving talent landscape and new ways of working, leaders who are willing to grow and evolve with the times – to be brilliant on today’s basics – are crucial. Ben shares, “When we talk about leadership, we're always talking about influence, right? And we're always talking about vision. No one ever says, hey, when you're a leader, don't be in that crystal palace in the sky and not be available. Be available. Basic. Be self-aware. We never talk about developing relationships all the way down. Be available, be personal, have relationships. It goes a long way. Do simple things. I'll write personal notes and send them to my field engineers. Little things like that are lasting and impactful.”
AI Readiness – while AI usage is growing, many companies need to start by being brilliant at their data hygiene to make the best use of the technology. Ben says, “Here at 3D Systems, we're in our own initiatives to figure out where it fits with regard to service. We had early adopters of AI that we use to troubleshoot with, and we've learned the pros and cons. But being brilliant on the basis is making sure your data is clean. Do it now. Because the competitors are doing it as well, and they're utilizing AI. AI is a tidal wave. Don't look at that as a cost. Just look at it as an investment in your future.”

What makes this more challenging for companies than maybe it should be I believe is the pace of change. Everyone is in a race to understand what’s next, what’s new, what’s the path ahead – it takes our focus away from the basics we need to be brilliant at and what it takes to do so.

The reality is that the two are intertwined – being brilliant on the basics involves continued focus on some of the core foundational elements of service we know matter most as well as the incorporation of new technologies, new ways of working, and new value streams. Keeping grounded in the customer lens is important – yes, they may be interested in a new service that innovation could bring, but not if you aren’t already capable of delivering a stellar experience, on-time, the first time.

There was loads more to Ben and I’s full podcast discussion, be sure to check it out here!

Episode 286

In this episode of the Unscripted podcast, host Sarah Nicastro welcomes back Roy Dockery, Author of The Art of Leading, for a discussion filmed at Future of Field Service Live in Stockholm on what leadership traits do (and don’t) create impact. Since this discussion, Roy has also taken the role of the Director of Field Service Research at TSIA.

Roy stands out as a transformative leader in the service sector, keynote speaker, and creator of an innovative leadership model based on truth, love, and empathy to enhance impact. His background as a millennial executive and former military personnel has trained him to effectively manage diverse, cross-generational teams across various industries.

Through his book, "The Art of Leading: Truth, Love and Empathy in Action," Roy shares this model with 13 fundamental principles, providing real examples of their application. He was also recognized as one of Hot Topic's top 100 Service Visionaries by a panel of global industry experts.

If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe, rate, and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.

Episode Highlights:

Roy - 00:00:00: One of the reasons I lean towards love is because I've worked around people for the last 15 years who love what they do. And as a leader and everyone who's ever done a ride along, right, like there's just something different you feel in field service. But it's because they actually love their job. So when I moved into management, I'm like, they deserve somebody that loves them as much as they love their job. Right. So like I need to love their job, but I also need to love them. So it kind of became a language that I use because it's what people in the field say. Right. Like people in service. It's not the income. They're normally some of the lowest paid people in the company. It's not the recognition because they're not getting any recognition. Right. It's not the customers. 90 percent of the time they're talking to angry people. They genuinely love what they do because they enjoy serving people. And so as a leader of people who serve like the best way for me to serve them is by loving them as well. And when I say love, I'm talking about like I want the best for them as human beings.

Sarah - 00:01:01: Hello, welcome to the Unscripted Podcast, where you'll find discussions on what matters most in service, leadership, and business transformation. I'm your host, Sarah Nicastro. Let's jump in. Okay, so welcome back, everyone. Half of the room had an opportunity already to meet Roy, but the other half has yet to spend some time with you. So why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself, tell everyone a bit about your background and what you've done recently, and then we'll get into it.

Roy - 00:01:30: Sure. So my name is Roy Dockery. I'm from the U.S. I live in an area, a small town called Whitsitt, North Carolina. So not jet lag, but did about eight and a half miles walking yesterday. So I think that helped me acclimate to the time difference. But been in field service since I got out of the military in 2010. So I've worked in transport automation, pharmacy robotics, autonomous mobile robots, and like automated packaging systems and things of that nature. And also spent the last two years in kind of a public safety security system. So license plate readers, gunshot detection systems, and things of that nature as well. But always in a field service leadership role. I've been in service leadership the majority of my life. I mean, assistant. Managed a pizza place when I was 17 years old. Owned and operated a restaurant in my 20s. So I've always kind of been in service and people leadership in general. Like in my personal life, I do a lot of counseling and mentoring and things of that nature as well. So that's what kind of put me on a path of leadership in general, outside of just work and field service. But as I was telling the team, I kind of decided a long time ago that I think I really enjoy leading people. So like that's the path that I took, even though I have a very technical background. I have a degree in nuclear engineering. I have a degree in information technology. I'm in a master's degree and a bunch of other stuff. So I went a very educational technical path. But then when I actually started working, I realized what I enjoy doing more than the technical stuff was actually leading people. So that's what I've done for the last 10 years.

Sarah - 00:02:59: Okay. Now the book came out a couple of months ago. Yes. Can you share with everyone sort of what prompted you to write the book?

Roy - 00:03:09: Yeah. So as someone that's been in leadership, one of the challenges that I had is that I've never really had a professional mentor. It seems weird. I'm an anomaly in my industry in the US for a variety of reasons, age, race, geography. So I've never really had a professional mentor. But for the majority of my career, I've mentored a lot of people. I've mentored a lot of people in service, outside of service, everything. I have mentees who are CEOs. I have mentees who are priests. I have mentees who are full-time music artists. I have mentees who are YouTube personalities and things of that nature. And so mentoring people over the years, and a lot of them, it always kind of came down to the same principle was like, how do I become a better person and how do I become a better leader? And so with that, over the last couple of years, I've been mentoring a cohort of probably over 50 people, and I have a podcast and some other things. And so I started with actually a series on my podcast that's just talking about leadership. So I walked through 13 principles that I thought were essential to being a leader in the way that we behave, the way that we engage with people, the way that we manage and delegate and deal with responsibility and accountability. And so I did the videos because I'm mentoring 50-something people who keep asking me the same question. Even though they come from different backgrounds, they have different professions. And so made the videos, people were like, okay, well, we need more information. Then I was like, all right. So then I wrote a book and I released the book. And then almost every mentees have read the book and they're like, okay, we still need more information, which led me to have to build an online course that gives them even more information and 95 lessons for them to walk through. But that's what it came out of. It came out of mentoring people. And when it came down to it, when I distilled all of the different experiences and people that I was mentoring, it all came down to they were trying to be more effective leaders, whether that was at work, in their personal lives, with their personal goals or their ambitions. So that's why I wrote the book on the art of leading and it was just hard for me. A couple of people mentioned it in their extra hour a day. I love reading, right? I've spent 12 years of my career traveling 50 to 75% of the time. Like on average, I was reading 75 to 100 books a year. But whenever somebody would ask me for a recommendation for a book to read, I could never give them one book. I always had to recommend like 17 books for somebody to read on leadership, depending on who they were. And there's a list of, and I know Sarah's read it, there's a list of books in the back of the book that if I had to give somebody a recommendation, but it's 20 plus books so I said, I enjoy writing. So I'm like, I'm going to write one book that in my mind can actually take a lot of different lessons and distill it down into one book so people don't have to go buy 25 of them.

Sarah - 00:05:48: Okay. So one of the things that you cover early in the book is that you view love as a fundamental element that can empower you to excel in leadership and drive remarkable outcomes. So can you talk about the importance of love in leadership or the role of it?

Roy - 00:06:07: Yeah. And I know I had a podcast on it. Love is a very misunderstood term because we look at love love romantically all of the time. And I was just sitting, I was thinking today, I saw the list of questions. One of the reasons I lean towards love is because I've worked around people for the last 15 years who love what they do. And as a leader and everyone who's ever done a ride along, right? Like there's just something different you feel in field service, but it's because they actually love their job. So when I moved into management, I'm like, they deserve somebody that loves them as much as they love their job. Right? So like, I need to love their job, but I also need to love them. So it kind of became a language that I use because it's what people in the field say, right? Like people in service, it's not the income. They're normally some of the lowest paid people in the company. It's not the recognition because they're not getting any recognition, right? It's not the customers. 90% of the time they're talking to angry people. They genuinely love what they do because they enjoy serving people. And so as a leader of people who serve, like the best way for me to serve them is by loving them as well. And when I say love, I'm talking about like, I want the best for them as human beings. Right? Like that's what that is. Like I want the best for you. And sometimes the best for you isn't over time. It might not be a promotion. It could be discipline. It could be development, just kind of like with our children or loved ones. That's why I kind of put it in that category because I think what we've done in a lot of our companies is we build our companies around who we like. We build our teams around who we like, right? Like the person that we like gets promoted. The person that we like gets recognized. But then what's weird is that relationship between the employees and the manager, the person that the manager or the executive likes, nobody else likes. And the reason you like each other is because you have similar interests. Like you're both into the same sport or you went to the same school where I think you level the playing field when it's like, look, I love everyone who works for me, whether I like you or not, right? So whether we get along or have similar interests or come from same backgrounds, like I owe every person that I lead the same amount of attention, the same amount of respect and the same amount of care. And when you lead, and I think that's fundamental to the way that you lead because we're all biased if we're honest, right? We're all biased to a certain regard. So if we don't base our leadership style off of something that actually equalizes the people that we're engaging with, we're going to wind up leaning towards and leading the people that we like more than the other people that we don't have that like initial connection with.

Sarah - 00:08:37: Yeah. So that leads me to a quote I want to share from the book where you are tying the importance of love to equity, right? So you say, equity has become a popular term, but I truly believe that love is the only true path to equity. Tolerance and inclusion can easily become prisons for those in the out group because to be given, access without true consideration is a cruel illusion. Can you talk a little bit about what that means?

Roy - 00:09:07: Yeah. And I think it kind of goes a little bit to my previous statement about the people that you like. Right. Like we want diversity. So we diversify the table. Right. I was just talking over lunch like field service doesn't have a lot of women. Right. Like in America and Sarah knows field service is mostly older white men. I am one of like three African-American vice presidents in field service in all of America. So like 10 years ago, Sarah was one of like two women and I was like one of two African-Americans like in an event that had four or five hundred people at it. So from a diversity perspective, if you don't actually care about the people you invite to the table, then you don't give them a voice. So, right. I checked the box because I added more women to the leadership team. I checked the box because I added more minorities to the leadership team or I allowed them in the room. But the voices that are speaking are the same. Right. So and that's why I say to give someone access. And I have a conversation. I think it's probably still on my YouTube channel as well. But there is a difference between using diversity as a token or allowing a diverse person to be a totem. Right. And that's like totem. So like in Native American folklore, totems are used to tell stories. Right. So when you look at them, they're like every section of the totem tells a story where like a token is just access. Right. You think about before everything was digital. You needed a token to get on the train. Right. Like so a token just gets you in and that's it. And so what I would tell a lot of people that I mentor is that like if you feel like all you got was access, then you're probably a token. They just let you in a room, but they don't let you speak. And your diversity isn't changing the story. Right. Because if I'm a totem, that means I'm a new layer within the organization. But that also means I should change the story. So like if you are only given access and you're not actually allowed to change the story. It's cruel because one, you're being publicly lauded as diversity, but privately, you just feel like you're there. Right. And I've been in that room in a variety of situations. Right. Like, you know, me and Sir and I were just talking. I think I've spoke at every technology conference in field service on the topic of diversity. I am not an expert.

Sarah - 00:11:22: On the last day.

Roy - 00:11:22: On the last day. And it's on the last day when everyone's flying out. But it's like people are just like, Roy, can you speak on diversity? Like. I don't have a degree in diversity, right? But like I am diversity, like just in existing, but I always try to expand that conversation and make it broader. And I have the patience to deal with it because I mentor people. But I think that's the challenge. Like a lot of times, like I said, we want to diversify, like if to use an illustration and I do a lot of this, it's like adding chairs to a table, but not adding microphones. So, right, if I was sitting at a table and everybody had a microphone, but then I add a table to the end and I add a chair to the end, but they don't have a microphone. So it's like it looks like they're in the room, but they don't have equal voice. And I don't think that's fair. And I think that's why, at least in the U.S., you're getting a lot of pushback on DEI programs because a lot of them gave access, but it didn't actually fundamentally change the organization. Right. So you hired different people, but then there was no innovation. There was no true benefit from diversity because people weren't given a voice. They were only given a seat.

Sarah - 00:12:26: And I think we talked about this a little bit in the breakout that I was in earlier. But, you know, people that are focusing on that because it's a checkbox exercise, right, is kind of what we're talking about. Whereas companies that really understand the value of people want to focus more on the inclusion and understanding and giving everyone that voice. And I like the point you make that as a leader, you don't have to like everyone equally, but you need to love everyone equally to make sure that you are being fair to your teams. Okay, so the next thing I want to talk about is authenticity. Okay, so you talk about how authenticity can unleash potential. So I'm going to share another quote. And it says, when you truly love and respect the authentic version of yourself, you grow to have a greater appreciation for the unique authenticity of others. Authenticity serves as an inspiration for others to do the same, leading to a collective unleashing of potential. Why do you think some leaders struggle with showing up authentically in their roles?

Roy - 00:13:34: I think the primary thing is that it's never really been exemplified, right? We talk about it, but for the most part, most of us were raised in cultures and traditions where we're told to compartmentalize, right? I've got my personal life. I've got my work life. But even within your personal life, you have pockets in your personal life, right? So those that are married, you've got the friends that you have with your spouse, but then you have your own friends, which is almost like a separate group, right? So I think we naturally are inclined to put things in boxes. And then when we show up to work, we show up to work in our work box. But there are skills and behaviors and things that we bring to the table that may not be specifically related to our job, but because it's a part of who we are, we can have influence in that area. Right. And so in the book, I talk about the fact that, like, I believe that everyone with influence is a leader and everyone has influence. So everyone is a leader in that regard. And you may not have a leadership role specifically within the organization, but it doesn't make you a leader. But the reason and what I tell my mentees all the time, and they're always struggling with work, right? They're burned out. And so and I remember I said it to one of my mentees and it stuck with me as well. I said, if only half of you shows up to work, why are you surprised that your job is twice as hard? So if you're a creative person, but only the analytical part of you shows up at work, then you're leaving an entire part of yourself at home because you don't think it's applicable or vice versa, right? You're a marketing person, but you can also do logistics and you're structured. But like you leave that part of your like we turn that part of our brains off or, you know, you're a people person, but you're not an extrovert. So then like at work and you're an individual contributor, so you don't interact much, but you could actually have a lot of influence and you can engage with people because I do a lot of public speaking. And Sarah knows like Sarah and I, neither one of us are extroverts. I'm a social introvert. I can socialize. I prefer not to write. I would rather go read a book in silence. But just because I can interact like. People assume and because I can be charismatic when I want to, people assume I'm extroverted. I'm not like doing this drains my energy. Right. But I think that's one of the challenges. So when you show up authentically and we learn that it doesn't matter where the skill came from, where the experience came from, like we show up in our totality. So when I'm in a meeting, even if we're having a meeting about something service related, like I've done sound engineering for 17 years. Right. I've organized my own events through a nonprofit that I own. So like I can speak to event planning, even though I'm the vice president of service. Right. I can speak to creative writing and marketing, even though that is not my job. It actually, it keeps me awake in a meeting, right? Because I can engage and interact in different ways with things that may not specifically be my role. But I'm authentically there. Like if I'm artistic, even though my job is technical, I can weigh in on artistic things other than kind of shutting myself down. And I think it allows you to have more access to more of a diversity of thinking right? And kind of seeking that feedback from different people. But you have to establish a culture and you have to exemplify what it looks like to show up and not just show up in the job title in the job description that you have. Again, I go back to love. If I love your entirety as a person, I understand you're a technician, but who else are you? I understand Electrolux. I know you work on appliances, but what else do you actually like to do? Because you'll talk to a technician. I had a technician who worked on mechanical systems at my company, Swisslog, but he built computers in his free time, had taught himself how to code when he was 12 years old, and he built motorcycles and cars in his spare time. So he was by far one of the most advanced technical software-oriented people that we had, but his job was working on pneumatic tube systems but getting to understand him and know him, it was almost like, yeah, you're too qualified for this job. You should go do something else. But he had no experience, so he couldn't put that on his resume because he had learned to do that in his free time. He never had it in a particular job. So I think that's where the authenticity comes from. It's like bringing all of your skills to the table and becoming comfortable speaking up. And I think that's why a lot of leaders don't do it, because we're used to just speaking based on our job description, based on our title, based on our responsibility and since we're not comfortable speaking outside of our box, we set that example for other people who stay to their box, right? I'm accounting. I only talk about accounting. I'm sales. I only talk about sales. But you have opinions on everything. So why are we afraid to share the opinions? You know, the worst somebody can say is no, right? I say that in the book. The worst somebody can say is no, but the best thing that they could do is adapt an idea from a different perspective that actually adds value.

Sarah - 00:18:30: How would you describe the tie of authenticity to empathy?

Roy - 00:18:35: Yeah, I think, right, empathy is putting yourself in somebody else's shoes, right? It's not just, oh, I can feel you, but like I can actually kind of like transpose myself into your situation and feel it. I think that requires a level of transparency. That you only get when you're authentic, right? Because first of all, most people aren't going to open up to you if you already appear to be closed off, right? So like the level of how much people share with you and how much people engage with you is going to be limited by how open they think you are. And if you're already compartmentalized to where you never talk about your personal life, you never talk about your children, you never talk about your marriage. If somebody is going through a divorce, like why are they going to bring up their marriage when you're asking them how they're doing, right? So like you see their performance slipping, but they've actually never seen a personal side of you where, you know, authentically, I think we're all going through stuff, whether it's medically, personally, financially, family issues, aging parents, right? There's things that if we're authentic and we share those experiences, especially during one-on-ones and conversations, you kind of open the door for people to bring you things to give you, because I think a lot of people, we can contextualize and find a way to be empathetic, but we haven't demonstrated it in a way where people actually feel like they can bring a problem to you. So it's not even that, you know, you shut it down, but like most people have learned over the course of their lives or their career to keep that stuff to themselves. So it's like you have to set that example and break that tradition that people have like kind of ingrained in them, because you have to realize that regardless of what you think your company culture is, it's just like relationships. People are bringing baggage, into their job. You may have never said keep home at home, but somebody did 10 years ago, right? So it may not even be you. You may be completely different, but you also have to lead as an example and you have to untrain people from unhealthy behavior that they've actually brought into your organization from other places. And so I think that's something people know. They're like, oh, we have a healthy culture, but if you're not doing anything to actively instill that into people and to help them understand what it is, then people are just going to be like, oh, we're going to keep going with the same behavior they had before. And then, you know, come through your organization and leave feeling the same way they did when they got there, because they didn't actually know that they were in a place where they could have been more open and would have gotten more empathetic responses from leadership.

Sarah - 00:21:03: So when we talk about love and authenticity and empathy, you know, they're all things that to some people, I think, can sound very soft or woo woo still, right, especially if they come from a different way of thinking. But you also talk about, you know, our skills that can have a big impact, but they're not skills that are used in isolation. So you say, you know, love without accountability becomes enabling. Honesty without tact, empathy or maturity can be damaging. I'm just wondering if you can share an example of love with accountability or balancing honesty and empathy just to sort of illustrate that, you know, applying these practices doesn't mean that you are just giving everyone hugs and, you know, letting everyone walk on you, right? It's their skills that are balanced with those other elements.

Roy - 00:21:59: Yeah. And that's one thing in the book, I had a lot of my mentees kind of read the pre-draft and there were some stories and they were like, no, we need more stories in the book. They were like, we've known you, we've worked for you. And so there's a section in the book called principles and action that is literally a story based on actual people that kind of lays out each one. But to give an example of love and accountability, we had an opening in Philadelphia, right? For a field service technician. And I went up to actually right outside of Erie, Pennsylvania. We interviewed a couple of candidates and we had a really solid candidate who was very honest, right? He wanted to relocate, had just went through a divorce, right? A really tough divorce. And he wanted to kind of get to a new area. So we hired him, moved him to Philadelphia. He had like 15 years of experience in field service. He was former military. But then we started getting complaints from the customer that he was falling asleep in the pharmacy. So like just sitting in the pharmacy, supposed to be doing maintenance and pulling data. He would just fall asleep at a desk in the pharmacy. And I'm like, what is going on? And then I sent somebody to do some training with them, sent a supervisor down there, and he got in a car accident because he fell asleep at the light. Not bad, but like bumped the car in front of him and he fell asleep. And so the very objective part of my brain is like, I have customers complaining that you're falling asleep, right? You're late from a response time perspective, probably because you're asleep or something's going on. And you just got in a car accident with another employee and the car, like you are a high risk. But like the part starting with love is that like, okay, I at least owe you a conversation to ask you what's going on. Like, can you explain to me why your fault, like what's going on? Like, is there something going on? Are you having trouble sleeping and all of this other stuff? And he actually admitted, he was like, well, I've been having a hard time sleeping. And so I asked, have you been to a doctor? You know, have you seen somebody and whatever else? And he had. So before I took action as a leader, I'm like, I at least want him to have an answer on what's going on. So he went to the doctor, actually discovered he had severe sleep apnea. Even though he was laying in bed, he was only sleeping like 45 minutes to an hour at night because his brain was being deprived of oxygen and his body basically kept shutting down. So, you know, so they put, they were like, you need to, you know, got to lose some weight because he had gained a lot of weight after his divorce. He had too much weight on his chest. And so going through that whole scenario, turned around a relationship with the customers, loved them, but on a discipline side. But then after that, then he started showing up. He wasn't meeting SLA. Something was going on. So I did the same thing, had a conversation. I said, hey, what's going on? You're not responding. And literally our contract stated our technicians are supposed to live within 45 minutes of their primary site. At the time I was living in Delaware, I lived an hour and 45 minutes from the customer. The customer called me. They had called him three hours before, right? I'm a VP at the time. I get in my car and I drive. To the hospital in Philadelphia. And I get there before he does. So now we're four hours and 45 minutes in and he didn't show up. And then when he arrived, I'm like, what's going on? What's happening? And he told me he moved. So he got into a new relationship. He got a girlfriend. He moved to New Jersey two and a half hours away. So he had an ultimatum. Like, I love you. I'm glad you got a new relationship. I'm glad you're doing better. Right. He had lost a ton of weight, you know, was healthier. He didn't need to see Pat machine anymore, but he didn't want to reload. Okay. So we terminated them. Same person. Right. But like, I have to hold you to the same expectation that I hold everybody else to. You made a personal decision that you knew because you were hiding it from us. You knew it was in violation of your employment contract. So unless you move, I'm going to have to hire somebody else. So we gave him time to transition. And when I actually went to go pick up the company vehicle from him, you know, I took him to breakfast. So I had another technician with me. We went and picked the vehicle up and he apologized. And he was like, I'm so sorry. You know, I should have, I'll let you all know or whatever else. And I still have a relationship with that person to this day. Right. So, you know, he went back, he, you know, works in another industry, has a good job, is remarried, and we still stay in touch and have that relationship. But I held him accountable to what his job called for. And, you know, we had already given him an opportunity to get rid of an issue that was actually a health problem that he could have got terminated for. And then he would have still had that issue moving forward if we didn't have just take that opportunity to have that conversation.

Sarah - 00:26:21: There were some questions earlier about recruiting, retention, and I'm just wondering if you can share maybe a synopsis of your observations on how do we find and nurture the next wave of talent?

Roy - 00:26:40: Yeah. So on finding and, you know, I think you were at, so I spoke a couple of weeks ago at Field Service Palm Springs, and there were kind of like four R's that I went through that we need to do to just the way that we recruit. So I think one of the problems that we've had in the field service industry for a long time, I've called our job descriptions, Dear John letters, right? So because our job descriptions look like we're trying to hire former employees. Right. Because when you look at the requirements of what I'm asking for a new employee to know how to do. It's the same requirements of the people who already work here. So how would I have two years worth of experience, especially if you don't have like a commodity and your equipment is proprietary? Like how would anyone have experience in proprietary equipment that only you sell? But it's in your job description. You have education requirements in your job description that none of your technicians actually have, right? So I remember seeing job descriptions that an associate's degree is required, you know, a bachelor's degree is preferred, but no technician in the field actually had that experience. So one thing that I've worked with organizations on and I've done it in every company that I am is go to your job description and compare your job description to the people who are actually performing well in the field today. Right. Because what you'll find is you had a referral that was an atypical candidate that you hired because a good technician recommended them. So you brought them on board and they're doing an amazing job and they completely defy your job posting. Right. So if you have atypical people within your organization. That are doing well, that are doing the job well, then go revise your job description based on those people so that you kind of expand the pool of candidates you're actually recruiting from, right? Because we're saying there's no talent out there, but it's because we've basically fished all of the talent out of that pool, but there's like a whole other ocean that we haven't even bothered to go check, right? And like those people, because we've invested in training, because we've got augmented reality, because we have all these tools, but I think the first hurdle is the pool of people you're recruiting from is actually smaller than it should be because you haven't got what your hiring managers and the teams that are actually leading the people on the ground and rewrote the job descriptions, right? So like pay attention to those referrals and things of that nature. And then also start getting the managers back involved in screening. We have to stop trusting all of the, I know we talk about AI a lot, but all of the rank-based keyword search screening that we're doing on resumes. One of the things that I've done at my two last companies is we let the tool run in grade resumes. Then I took a group of managers and had them go through resumes blind and grade them. And the grades were the opposite. So what the system said was an A or B. My manager said they would not hire those people. And what the system said was a C or a D. My managers wanted them at the top of the pile to interview so that's the other thing is that we're also using tools that are not evolving, right? Because the tool is based on historical data. So those are the resumes we were using. Those are the resumes that were successful. But now you need a different group of people. So re-involve those hiring managers and let them dive into the system and just look at resumes blind. Because normally what you see as the hiring manager is what's been screened by human resources, right? So there's a thousand applicants and maybe you get to see eight or nine. And what I've learned, let the manager go dig through a thousand applications and I guarantee you they'll find you over a hundred candidates that otherwise would have been screened out because they know what it takes to do the job. They know who they can train and they can see skills in those resumes that the system or that keywords won't catch. So, and that's one. And on retention, care for your employees, respect them and value them, right? That was my last, I do leadership tips on LinkedIn and Instagram Monday through Friday of every week but that's, yeah, make sure they feel cared for, make sure they feel respected. A shortcut for respecting technicians, ride-alongs, respect and value. You get a two for one if you do a ride-along with a technician, especially if you're not from the service organization. So encourage other people in the organization to go spend time with technicians because that isolation that we talked about earlier, like that, they start to feel more a part of the company when more people within the company actually understand what they do because they stood beside them. And even if it's two hours or three hours, that'll help you with a lot of retention because they feel more connected to the company. And it's harder for them to get poached by somebody that just sees them while they're out and about or somebody that, you know, that may jump into their email to recruit them because they feel more connected to the company.

Sarah - 00:31:34: Last year at our Paris event, there was a presentation by Culligan, and they actually shared that they have, I think it's a certain month of the year within their company that every employee that isn't in service is paired for a day with someone who is, whether it's call center, field service, et cetera, to spend the day with them. It helps them understand those roles better, but also understand the customer needs better. And it's something that within the company is so valued on both sides. To your point, the technicians and the service teams feel that they're being acknowledged for the important work that they do. But then the people within the company appreciate it because they learn so much and they see so much of what goes on and what the customer sentiment is and all of that. So it's a good point. Can you speak to what makes one adept at having hard conversations effectively?

Roy - 00:32:30: Yeah, Crucial Conversations. Another great book, by the way, if anyone has read it. I think having hard conversations requires, on the listener's side, it requires a level of emotional intelligence. One thing that I tell people, and me and my wife also do marriage counseling, we do a lot of things what it applies at work is that you have to learn how to listen past being offended that helps in every area of life, but we tend to get defensive very early in a conversation. You're not actively listening in a defensive standpoint because you're trying to now find how you can counter or counterpunch or offer a rebuttal instead of listening. I think you have to be intelligent enough and emotionally intelligent you enough that even when you hear something that you think is false or inflammatory or offensive, you have to keep actively listening. Because what I've learned over time and being in service, and I think, sir, we've talked about this before, angry people are the most honest. It's a hard conversation, but everyone in here has heard something about their service team, their product, or their offering from an angry customer that was 100% correct that they had never said to you when they weren't angry. Because there's a level of honesty that most of us withhold until we're angry. It's like when you say the mean things. But when customers do that, as service leaders, when we listen, I've had customers that will complain about a technician that they've had for 17 years that I'd never heard a complaint about. But in the same regard, they talk about how they have a bunch of new employees and I don't have time to be training them, so I need your technician. So I'm like, okay, we weren't hitting our SLA, we were late, but you also just shared with me, you have a bunch of people who you're contractually obligated to have trained on my system who are not trained. So one of the reasons it keeps breaking and I have to keep responding is because you have people using it who are not trained, right? So I'm going to deal with my response time issue, but then let's have a conversation about training and how can I help you? How can we facilitate some professionalization development? Do you want to bring some people out? Because ultimately, it's going to save me money on my service contract, but you've got to be able to hear something difficult, whether you think it's true or not, and continue to actively listen through the part that you're offended by, and then be able to take that information and articulately respond to what's actionable. You got to throw out all of the subjective stuff that's just emotion and kind of learn how to sort through that. But when something is true, it doesn't matter how it was delivered. It's true, right? So you may not have liked the way that they said it. You may not have liked the context, but it's true. So you need to respond to that and you need to follow through on it. And I think that gives customers, honestly, a level of comfort and safety to know that they can just unload on you. You're not going to take it personal. And then you'll actually help them figure out their problem. And the same thing applies to technicians, right? People want to come. Or your management staff or whatever. They just want to get stuff off of their chest and then get it out on the table. And you can throw a bunch of stuff on the table. I might pick three things and say, well, I can help you with this, this, and that. So let's talk about that. But it creates that space where people are not afraid to offend you. So they can just be honest and they can be open and just kind of let it all out. But you've got to be able to not be quick to be offended because that's the easy way to get shut down. And I talk about what people bring in to work relationship. A lot of people are bringing in, okay, well, when I was honest before, I got shut out. I was isolated. I got blackballed or I became the outcast at my last company. So you've got to make sure that you don't repeat the same thing when people are being honest, even if they're tact or their tone could be a little bit different. And I tell my team all the time, if they're right, they're right. I don't care how they said it. Get over it. It's our job to deal with the issues. And sometimes those issues are going to come. Enter like twist it with a lot of emotion and frustration. But you've got to be able to unwind the two, not be offended and just listen and then have that crucial conversation.

Sarah - 00:36:58: Okay, last question before I open it up. What advice do you have for someone who is working in an environment where they want to deploy some of these principles, but there's toxicity higher up in the organization?

Roy - 00:37:13: So we talked about this a little bit in my session downstairs, but do what you can where you have control. Right. So a lot of times we want to go to the top with the change. But if the resistance is at the top, that doesn't work. But I think where you have influence, use it. Right. So if you're a manager and you're managing, you know, like even looking at my career. Right. I wasn't a manager, but I was the trainer responsible for techs in the Northeast. And the culture that I developed with people that I was training is actually what led to me becoming the manager. But I was also one of five managers. Right. So the way that my region was run in the culture that we had was not the same in the other five regions. But when people saw the culture actually in my region, they actually demanded that the other manager be fired. So the technicians actually got together and collectively wrote negative feedback on their service manager and said that, like, he's breaking the law. He's asking us to do stuff that they're not doing right on the other side of the border. And we work at the same company. So even though, like, I didn't do anything specifically, but just because of the culture that you created, I think, you know, there's adjacency where people will see it and say, OK, like, that's something that we want to adopt as well. But I think it's doing what you can in your sphere of influence that you have control over. Right. And some of that, like, you know, I don't know how rigid companies are, but like the way that you can recognize your employees. Right. The way that you can recognize leaders on your team. That can be an email out to your employees. Right. So like even, you know, in every company that I've worked at, there was always something that we did within my team, whether it was customer care or operations that the rest of the company did not do. But if the company doesn't want to adopt like a leadership program, then like I'm going to put it in my budget. I'll borrow it from somewhere else. Right. And so I take it out of my own budget or out of our manager's travel budget and we make it work. Right. And so we have ways to recognize employees. And there were times that I paid for stuff out of my own pocket. Right. Buying somebody a fifty dollar gift card isn't, you know, and then when people see their reaction to it and the response, then it winds up being funded. But I think that's the key thing. Like we want these like sweeping organizational wide changes. But the reason people are afraid to take that step at the executive level is because if they make this grand gesture and it fails, then what do you do? Right. So I think it's actually easier for when you have a smaller team and a more controlled space and then just try to do some things to encourage leaders. Right. Lead authentically. Be empathetic. Right. And then make sure that it's also reflected in your policies and the way that you operate and the way that you train and the way that you onboard. Because you're responsible for the culture that you have the most influence over. Right. So like even if you're in a company with an overall toxic culture, it is your responsibility as the leader to make sure you are the umbrella and that that doesn't go down to your team as much as possible. Right. So I think that's the main thing. Like we have more influence than a lot of times we think we do, especially when we're not on like that executive leadership team or whatever. You know, that dogmatic group of people that are set aside as the change agents. They're not like you have individual technicians that have more influence than your CEO. Right. Across the overall organization, if they say something, people listen. So it's getting with those people and then using your influence as a manager, director or VP to change the culture around you. And then I guarantee you it will start seeping into teams that you don't run because behavior is contagious. So toxic behavior can be contagious, but also healthy, productive behavior can be contagious as well. Because when people see things that they like and that they appreciate, then they try to replicate it as well.

Sarah - 00:41:04: Questions for Roy.

Speaker 3 - 00:41:06: Great. Thank you for a good session. One question regarding the recruitment session where you went into the recruiting manager to dig into the CVs. How can you elaborate a bit about not being biased when you look into the CVs, the people applying for the job? If you dig in and came from the same area or have the same former employee. Yeah, if you can elaborate on not being biased when you look into CVs.

Roy - 00:41:32: Yeah, right. And you're talking about that experience. I think one of our, it's not necessarily a problem, but we've been spoiled by the fact that we get a lot of applicants that look like the people we already have. Right. So when I look at their resume, it's like, oh, I hired somebody from this company before and they worked out. I think one of the ways that you overcome that bias is by and to use a photography term, right, is to expand that aperture because there are people at your company. You have no idea where they came from. Right. Like you don't know where their background is. So like the more that you actually understand the different people who work for you and where they came from, like you have somebody that's outside of that, like because 70 to 80 percent of them are normally relatively similar. But you have like a 20 percent that's not. And so once you see that and you recognize like, oh, these people can also be successful. I think experience in relationship changes bias. Right? Because I think there's a certain kind of person that works when in reality you have people right now that don't actually fit that mold. You just don't know that. Right. So that's why I say like when you engage the hiring managers and the supervisors who actually know more about the specific details of all the people that are working, like you start to understand the different types of people who are good at doing this job. So then when you look at a resume, you're looking at skills and you're not. You're not looking at they came from this company. They came from this school. They came from that background. You're looking for behavior and skills. Right. And I think that's like shifting towards skills in behavior based recruiting. I think every company should have a behavior assessment that you use to give you behavioral based interview questions. Stop asking the generic. What is your greatest strength? What is your greatest weakness? Right. Like have an assessment that gives you better behavioral questions. And you just got to stop giving so much weight to experience that you're used to. Because first of all, you're running out of it. Right. Like you're running out of those people anyway. But you already have some people in your organization. If you went and kind of like look through that don't meet the mold. But we treat them as exceptions. And they're really not exceptions. They just would have been eliminated by our current screening process. Right. Because if they can do the job well, we didn't have special training for them. Right. They came through the same onboarding process, went through the same training, and they're successful at the job. So I think we've got to stop focusing so much on experience and really look at the skills. And you're going to get that more from your hiring managers and your supervisors, like the people who actually work with them day in and day out. Then you are from like a recruiter who may understand the job description, but has never actually done the job in the field. So it's involving those managers and letting them look at resumes. I think we'll help everybody kind of undo their bias because we've been spoiled. Right. Like in the U.S., my service organization was 80 percent ex-military. But ex-military in the U.S. Are just high school graduates that went to trade school that was run by the military. So why would I not just hire a high school graduate that went to a trade school or a high school graduate that would do well in trade school but hasn't gone? Right. So when we change that, then like the organization became like 40 percent ex-military. And we started hiring more people that were 20 or 21 or 22 years old when we just kind of adjusted that and stopped just picking from ex-military people because that's where we had hired from for five or seven years.

Sarah - 00:45:15: All right. Roy, thank you so much.

Field service organizations have been striving over the last number of years to bring more women into roles, to varying degrees of success. Many have reported that they’ve struggled to recruit and retain woman technicians, even more so than other diverse groups they’ve aimed to welcome into their workforces.

These challenges become easy to comprehend when you consider related recent news such as how, “despite the many academic symposiums, STEM programs, and corporate efforts towards diversity, the high tech sector has made frighteningly little progress over the past two decades, according to a new report by the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC).”

All the while, much debate is taking place over the validity and impact of DEI efforts (and even how best to refer to these efforts). In a recent article for BBC News, technology editor Zoe Kleinman discusses how women’s STEM supports are waning as a result of this debate (along with corporate budget cuts and culture shifts). She specifically notes the closure of two impactful groups: the charity Women Who Code, a US-based group with 145,000 members that in June announced it was shutting down “due to factors that have materially impacted our funding sources;” as well as the US non-profit community Girls in Tech that closed in July after 17 years (also reportedly with lack of funding as the main reason).

Existence of these groups is an essential component of how we continue to make much-needed progress in gender equity. We spoke recently with California-based Tradeswomen Inc., a grassroots non-profit focused on recruitment, retention, and career development for women in the skilled trades industries. Melinda Ramirez, the group’s development manager, and Felicia Hall, workforce development manager, share how the organization is bringing women and employers in the trades together.

Felicia Hall

Melinda Ramirez

Future of Field Service: Can you tell us about the mission of Tradeswomen Inc.?

Melinda Ramirez: Our organization is non-profit, we’ve been around for about 45 years, and our mission and our work is centered around improving equity in the skilled trades, mostly construction trades, and increasing the number of women and LGBTQ employees in the trades.

Most estimates say 11% of the employees in the industry are women, but really only about 4% of employees in the trades are women that actually work with tools. We do outreach for recruitment, retention, and leadership development. We go to a lot of career fairs, try to help guide women into pre-apprenticeships, and help them to apply to different registered apprenticeship programs. We also helping them with resources to support their efforts, like gas cards and child care stipends.

Our previous director, Meg Vasey, works with the National Taskforce on Tradeswomen’s issues, and they focus on policy and law. For example, one item that was recently passed was having separate bathrooms or porta-potties for men and women on jobsites. They have also worked on mandating better fitting safety gear, since most safety gear and hardhats were designed for men.

We will soon go to New Orleans for the Tradeswomen Build Nations conference, and I am meeting up with people from all over the world who are working on policy and gender equity.

Felicia Hall: We work directly with recruiters, and we have a newly developed Multi-Craft Core Curriculum (MC3) apprenticeship program with NABTU (North American Building Trades Union). That allows candidates to get into a paid, union apprenticeship.

A lot of the work we do is in advocacy and getting knowledge out there about the trades. Many women don’t know these roles are even an option. We focus a lot creating awareness among high school graduates about the trades and the opportunities available.

We have a monthly apprenticeship workshop, where we explain the benefits and some of the challenges of working in the trades. As women in the trades, you do face discrimination, and they will push you to your limit. As a woman you need to be able to pick up your ladder or tools and move them yourself. We talk about the importance of that independence as a woman on a job site, and how to conduct yourself on a job site.

Future of Field Service: What are some of the biggest challenges in connecting women with jobs in the trades?

Felicia Hall: A lot of the challenges are just getting women to commit. There can be fear because this is unfamiliar to them. We have to convince them to consider the opportunity. We also face challenges around availability. Once people hear about us, they want us everywhere. We are small but mighty, so we try to do as much outreach as possible.

Melinda Ramirez: Any kind of contract with federal funding requires hiring a certain number of women, minorities, and apprentices, and there is a formula companies have to follow. It can be difficult for them to find qualified individuals, and we see a lot of challenges because they hire an apprentice, give them half a shot, and then move on to a more experienced person so they can say they fulfilled their requirements.

I read an article recently about the difference between mentorship and sponsorship. A mentor in the trades will give you advice and point you in the right direction, whereas a sponsor will take a risk on you, introduce you to the right players, and give you the big jobs. Men tend to get more sponsorships, where women experience more mentorship without anyone taking risks on them.

Women also don’t see themselves reflected in leadership roles in these companies. If you don’t see women in those positions, it can be hard to stick with it. Most women tend to leave the trades within the first four years, and there are a lot of reasons for that, but it really comes down to changing the worksite culture. That takes time and work and has to start from leadership and move down.

Future of Field Service: For companies that want to recruit and retain more women in these positions, what are some helpful strategies?

Melinda Ramirez: You need flexibility, and what I mean by that is making small accommodations, like offering a time and place for lactation when women come back from maternity leave, for example.

Companies also need to be understanding about childcare issues, Women tend to be caregivers for children and in some cases their parents, and because of the early start on jobsites that can be difficult. Most daycares do not open at 4 a.m.

There should also be a path for upward mobility. If you give them opportunities and have women in leadership roles, you will attract more women at an entry level.

Felicia Hall: When we work with companies that have women in leadership positions, they often tell us they prefer to hire women because they are more meticulous and pay attention to detail. We have seen data that shows when you have one woman on a job site, you get a 15% higher safety record. Just by having one woman in any role on a job site improves the safety on that job site.

Future of Field Service: Are you seeing promising trends around promoting the trades to younger women, and students in general?

Melinda Ramirez: We are trying to get information to youth at an early age, even as young as middle school. You have to show them that this is an option, because a four-year college is not for everyone.

You can learn more about Tradeswomen Inc. and the work they’re doing on their website. The group holds a monthly apprenticeship workshop on the third Thursday of every month via Zoom. (Registration is required.) If you happen to be in California, they are also holding a fundraiser on Nov. 16 in Alameda, CA.

In this episode of the Unscripted podcast, host Sarah Nicastro welcomes Ben Williams, Director of Service Operations for Americas at 3D Systems, for a conversation around his advice to “be brilliant on the basics,” how that differs from the idea of mastering the basics, and what basics in service demand regular attention.

Passionate about service and additive manufacturing, Ben helps companies harness technology to drive innovation, growth, and customer satisfaction. With vast experience in prototyping and manufacturing, he had witnessed the transformative impact of additive manufacturing on businesses firsthand.

If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe, rate, and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.

Episode Highlights:

Ben - 00:00:00: Change is coming no matter what. You just got to accept that you have to be agile such that, one, with going back to processes, we might have to change our process because we're going to make us more efficient. We have to get rid of the old, we can't stand crap and keep these old processes. And this was a lot of my own medicine here too, because when something is running right, you don't want to change it. But you can't look down for the now, you have to look ahead for the future.

Sarah - 00:00:36: Welcome to the UNSCRIPTED Podcast. I'm your host, Sarah Nicastro. Today, we are going to have a conversation about the importance of being brilliant on the basics. So service organizations in all industries across the globe are looking for what their next initiative will be to continue their quest for service transformation, service innovation. The reality is, before we take next steps, we need to make sure that the foundation that we have in place is solid and gives us a good place to start from. So to have that conversation with me, I am excited to welcome to the podcast, Ben Williams, who is the Director of Service Operations for the Americas at 3D Systems. Ben, welcome to the podcast.

Ben - 00:01:33: Thank you.

Sarah - 00:01:34: Yes, it's great to have you here. So before we get into our conversation around being brilliant on the basics, tell everyone a little bit more about yourself.

Ben - 00:01:43: I've been in the manufacturing world for 17 years now. I started from the bottom in service as a field engineer working my way to my current position. I've dabbled in tech support, new product introduction, but it's been a fun ride along the way. Crazy ride, fun ride though. So I'm really glad I'm here.

Sarah - 00:02:00: Awesome. So for folks that might not be familiar with what 3D Systems does, can you just give a quick overview of what the business is?

Ben - 00:02:09: Yes. So we were the pioneers of 3D printing, where you basically print a three-dimensional figure out of photosensitive resin, powder, metal. We've been in the industry for a long time. So 3D is a global company. Has printers printing currently in healthcare, industrial, and all the major 500 companies. So kind of touch a lot of new technologies and innovate a lot of new things.

Sarah - 00:02:35: Excellent. Okay. All right. So we're going to get into some of the specifics around this. But before we even do that, can you just kind of share your thoughts on why this concept of being brilliant on the basics is so important in service today?

Ben - 00:02:52: Yeah, so when you called me and we were talking, we talked about brilliant on the basics. It's basically right under my nose. I've been doing this for a while. I think it's important because you, one, if you're brilliant on the basics, you create a solid operational foundation, which aligns you for a long-term growth and sustainability. And the byproduct of that is increasing your customer experience.

Sarah - 00:03:18: Yeah, I think I really liked the phrase a lot because I think there's different... For me, there's different areas in the service world you can think about how it applies to. But for instance, when you think about the customer experience, right? And then how that ties in with the opportunity to grow service revenue or diversify service offerings, right? If you aren't brilliant at the basics, you don't communicate cleanly, you're not on time for appointments, you don't have employees that have the ability to develop good relationships with your customers, right? They're not going to want more from you. You're not going to be set up to expand upon that. And I think the other lens I thought about it through is related to the pace of change in service today when it comes to technology and digital transformation. There's so much happening so quickly. And I think companies sometimes chase what's new without making sure they have mastered the basics. And that can be really challenging. So I think this premise of coming back to like whatever you want to build next, the blocks that lie below that, how good are we there? And do we feel we're really strong before we try and take the next step? So I think it's really good advice.

Ben - 00:04:43: Yeah. I would agree with you. I've listened to a couple of your long-time listeners, first-time callers, and I've listened to a lot of your podcasts. And a lot of your guests have brilliant, great ideas and concepts. But like you just said, if for our keystones and our foundation aren't right, then it's really hard to optimize with these great ideas.

Sarah - 00:05:02: For sure. Okay, so let's talk about some of the areas where you found this to be applicable and important, right? So we talked about a couple different examples, so we'll just go through those. So the first, which I kind of referenced, but in a very general way, is customer communication. So when you think about being brilliant on the basics with customer communication, like what comes to mind?

Ben - 00:05:29: How they want to be contacted, how they communicate, right? So what are our main choices nowadays? Email, voice, text. A lot of the times we default to the easiest form of communication, right? Email, right? Or, well, good or bad, but we're in service a lot of times is bad. And that's not necessarily the best way to communicate. I think it might be a generational thing here. Just because you put urgent on the subject line of an email doesn't mean it's going to be important. If it's something that's important, people forget. Pick up the phone and call. If you're in an escalated issue or process, communicate. Don't hold secrets. Communicate. Very, very simple foundational things. And these are concepts that us as leaders probably know because it was 20 years ago. That's what we were doing. But we're in a different time now. You have to teach these things. Something that's important, call. If you have an issue, customers need to know the status so they can make decisions. Communicate. Very simple.

Sarah - 00:06:34: Yeah, it's a good point. Like you said, we as leaders, we know this, but we need to teach this. And that made me think about a couple of things. I think when it comes to like this concept we're talking about today of being brilliant on the basics, any of the things we're going to touch on, you could be like, okay, well, of course. Of course. However, the root of what businesses are getting wrong, I bet 75 plus percent of it comes back to falling short in the basics, right? Like they're trying to get ahead of that rather than going into some of those things. The other thing I was thinking is something that is foundationally important to be good at. And not only good at, but predictably reliable at and like solid on, right? Like some of these things. They probably demand more revisiting than we give them, right? So leaders who yes, you learned how to communicate, you know how to communicate, you know communication is a critical part of the customer relationship. So why would it be that maybe a new employee has that as probably a pretty brief part of their onboarding and then never hears about it again, right? Like, we tend to then focus on training on new product or this or that, but not come back to these concepts that we know are fundamentally very important to our success.

Ben - 00:08:07: Yeah. How do you interview for these tangibles communication, right? Sure people are practicing in the interview environment, but especially with the onboarding process, you throw a laptop at them, you throw a cell phone at them in a toolbox and you throw them in training. How do you teach them to be the face of your company in front of the customer? And that's something as leaders that we have to mentor them and teach them to communicate. And not the time all the way down.

Sarah - 00:08:35: Yeah.

Ben - 00:08:35: Right.

Sarah - 00:08:36: I was thinking about that, too, when you were talking about the idea of different channels of customer communication, which is a part of it. But also, you just said, how do you equip? The frontline to be the face of the business and the face of the brand. Also, though, I mean, just looking beyond the scope of field technicians, right? You mentioned the idea of when things reach escalation or things go wrong, be proactive, be transparent, have that good communication. You also have to think about, or maybe not, I don't know, and it doesn't matter if this is relevant to 3D, but depending on what industry you're in and who your customers are, they might have these different preferences. Maybe they take to Twitter. Well, X, sorry, I'm still in the Twitter era. And they're adding your business with a complaint. And how bad it looks as someone on the outside when you're scrolling through and the company just doesn't respond. I mean, to your point, like you said, we kind of tend toward whatever is easiest, but you also have to be conscious of what those customer preferences are, where all they're showing up, and how easy are you making it for them to engage with you when they need something, when they don't need something, when they have good feedback, when they have negative feedback. There's a lot that comes with that. So it's an area that I think is really, really important. And as it continues to evolve, it's one that you have to keep coming back to because those preferences are changing. The technology is changing how we have some of those interactions. The generation of the talent we're bringing in changes the dynamic. There's all of these different things that make this really simple, basic, quite dynamic in a way that we have to keep it top of mind. So that's a good one. The next one we talked about is data and AI.

Ben - 00:10:36: I'm not going to be honest with you. We could probably have a whole other podcast about data AI. It's exploded. Here at 3D Systems, we're in our own initiatives to figure out where it fits, where it synchronizes with regard to service. We had early adopters of AI that we use to troubleshoot with, and we've learned the pros and cons. I will say some, through it on the basis is make sure your data is clean. When I say that, make sure that we collected data for a lot of years. And now that we have it, and then AI is able to utilize it, you run into issues where the data wasn't clean, so you're not getting the results you want to put in versus input out.

Sarah - 00:11:19: Yeah.

Ben - 00:11:20: Take the time to clean your data. Do it now. Because the competitors are doing it as well, and they're utilizing AI. AI is a tidal wave. Write it, use it, everybody else is. But clean your data. Make sure your data is clean. And don't look at that as a cost. Just look at it as an investment in your future. Clean your data. Make sure everyone listening will totally agree with me on that one.

Sarah - 00:11:46: Yeah. For sure. The next one we talked about is process optimization. And again... With keeping top of mind how frequently that is or is not happening, right? So can you talk a little bit about that one?

Ben - 00:12:03: Yeah. So I think everyone would agree it's cheaper to optimize than to spend. Where we run into issues is your old process might not be able to handle all the new optimization and efficiencies you want. So what happened two years ago and that great process you developed two years ago might not be able to handle the technology, the synchronization. All of it was something new, right? And so we're not saying those processes were bad in the future. They were probably great for 2000 or 2018. But 2024, you might want to be able to or have to revisit some of these processes, these key processes, right? For example, how you ingest data, right? In 2024, there might be new regulations. That whole process doesn't work. Have a way or an interval to monitor your processes, update them regularly, quarterly, or whatever your company needs or your service needs. Just be able to ensure that your foundational process can handle a lot of these new processes that everybody else wants to incorporate. It seems like every year you want to add a different branch to the tree. Just ensure the trunk can handle all that.

Sarah - 00:13:22: So in your opinion, what is the appropriate frequency to be digging into that?

Ben - 00:13:32: Who asked that trick question, and I'll tell you why. Everybody has a different cadence, right? And so with everyone's different cadence, there would be different frequencies at which you probably should review your processes. For me and our process, probably every year. Just to ensure and it'll help us where we're at, where we've come from, where we're at, and then which direction we want to go forward, right? And that'll help with a lot of your budgeting and operational spend.

Sarah - 00:14:00: Yeah.

Ben - 00:14:01: Right. They all kind of synchronize together.

Sarah - 00:14:03: Yeah, I think going back to our title too. So on a time interval, you're saying every year, but also we talked about before your next initiative, which is also a really good prompt, right? Whatever you're looking at investing in or changing or transforming, not just assuming, okay, let's take what we're doing and make it better, but let's first go back and think about is what we're doing still the best way to do it, right? Because going back to the point I made earlier about the pace of change, I think this is a really tough one for organizations, in my opinion, because change is happening so fast that when you find a process that works, you just double down on it. You know what I mean? And you're not always willing to do the hard work of reflecting and thinking about like, okay, well, yeah, this is how we've done it. And maybe it is working, but is it what's best? Is it what's setting us up for our future success? And that is, I think, I see a lot of companies that will, let's say, invest in field service software, demand that it fits their processes versus adjusting at all. Only to have to go back and undo it at some point because they then realize like, okay, well, to keep pace with the technological change or to keep pace with the way that our customers want to do business or to keep pace with the opportunity for growth for our business. We have to do things differently. I think about this a lot, even we're stepping outside of service directly for a moment. But with the challenge companies have to hire the, I've written about this a lot and I've talked about a lot because it frustrates me and I get it right. Like I get it. This is actually something that I also identify a lot with in my life, because there are times where I realize I have a very inefficient process and I stick with it because it's just the time to just like change it. Do you know what I mean? Like it's like, I'm going to keep just doing this. You know what I mean? And-

Ben - 00:16:11: - my name is Ben and I do have processes and I don't want to change it.

Sarah - 00:16:16: Yeah. But with the hiring topic, it's like the world we're in really, really demands companies shake things up at the root and really break down. No, this is how we do it. No, this it doesn't matter anymore, right? But the way that companies are holding on to that rather than just try something different. So I think there's like there's this refinement and review of processes that's important. But there's also this like deeper reflection on, do we need a more disruptive change in a certain area?

Ben - 00:16:51: So I know we're talking, our title brilliant is really on the basis. We're about to get a little complicated here. A lot of times it's because of everything is tribal knowledge, right? So if everything is held up here, this tribal knowledge is not documented, then it makes that whole going back to make sure you have the most efficient process. Or like you said, and I said, well, we've always done it this way. It works. But a lot of times, like you said, it doesn't support new service software and new service processes. And you end up doing a rework. Which we might have had to have done or might have not, and it's costly.

Sarah - 00:17:28: Yeah.

Ben - 00:17:28: Yeah.

Sarah - 00:17:30: Yeah, it's definitely not. It's not something that's easy, right? But I think it's something that companies need to grapple with and figure out what that balance is and what that, like you said, everyone has their own cadence, everyone has their own ecosystem, but what does that look like? And how do you make sure you're not beholden to processes or goals, beliefs that just really are rooted in, like you said, what the business's identity was in 2018 versus 2024? So the next one we talked about, I think, is in a lot of ways correlated, which is the area of strategic alignment in the business and working to either. Break down or minimize silos, or at least enable a really good cross-functional working relationship. So what are your thoughts on this one?

Ben - 00:18:21: Network, network, network, right? Here's why. Don't operate in silos and within your same company. It makes no sense. You need to understand what the other business units are doing, why they're making decisions, and their perspectives. Not only their perspectives on what the company's direction is, but how are you aligned with them, right? Everybody's like, get on the boat, let's go, but the boat can't go two ways. You need to, and a lot of times there's a lot of synergy involved, right? If you understand what your sister business unit, brother business unit is doing, a lot of times there's tools that they're using that you can use and you can lower your operational costs. And we've learned that. It's just being, how can you be part of the team if you're not networking and you're not looking over and seeing what we're doing? There's no, and in the long run, there is no such thing as silos. It's going over, meeting someone else in a different department. Those don't be a service department in the company, but be part of the team.

Sarah - 00:19:24: Yeah. Yeah. I think the other thing that always comes up in this conversation is going back to the customer experience. More and more companies that aren't doing that, they're not working as one, they're not unified in their approach and in their perspective of what everyone is working on and working toward, that's reflected in the customer experience. And that is challenging.

Ben - 00:19:48: Yeah, the customer sees 3D Systems. They don't see 3D system service. They don't see 3D Systems, customer service or accounts payable. They see 3D Systems as a team, you have to have a solid front. We don't have different processes all over. But yeah, from a customer experience standpoint, they strategically aligned, eliminating silos is one of the best things you can do as a company in a whole.

Sarah - 00:20:16: Yeah. Okay, the next one is operating in an agile or nimble manner as a business.

Ben - 00:20:24: So what's that song? Change is going to come. Oh, yes, it will, right? Changes coming no matter what. And you just got to accept that you have to be agile such that, one, with going back to processes, we might have to change our process because we're going to make us more efficient. We have to get rid of the old, we can't stand crap and keep these old processes. And this is a lot of my own medicine here too, because when something is running right, you don't want to change it, but you can't look down for the now, you have to look ahead for the future. And that's where this being able to be agile, and being able to be agile and able to accept change, that's basically where I wanted to go with this. And agile doesn't necessarily mean just business processes though too. We're in a business environment. And agile can be personnel changes, right? It can be restructuring, right? It can be leadership changes. So this is more of a internal reminder like, hey, businesses have to operate and they have to be profitable. In order to be profitable, sometimes you have to shake things up. Actually, a lot of times you have to shake things up, especially in this changing time. And this is just a reminder, very end of A, be able to be mentally ready to be able to be agile, be agile. And I'm saying this, like I said, this is my own medicine here.

Sarah - 00:21:49: It's a mantra. Yeah, I mean, I think we going back to like how quickly things are changing. And you said like, this is an internal thing. I think the ability to get good at being nimble within the business, making informed decisions in a timely manner, keeping pace with customer desires and needs in real-time, keeping abreast of technology changes and innovations and what is or isn't applicable to your business, all of these things. That is what, doing that well is what allows you to keep up with the pace of change that's happening outside the business. If you're not doing that, you're really internally falling behind even before that might be visible to your customers or competitors or what have you. You have to figure out how to operate in a way that is more streamlined than it used to need to be.

Ben - 00:22:51: And be able to anticipate change. I think that's a developed skill, right? It's like having a little, if you have some foresight, then you have the skill to anticipate change where you're going to have to turn. Or like Yogi Bear says, you're going to have, there's a fork in the road, take it. So, but that's a skill I've learned over the last years. It's a hard skill to learn. Sometimes you go off first and then you start looking for change.

Sarah - 00:23:16: Yeah. I think what's interesting is in a lot of ways, COVID forced companies to reconcile that need. But what's been interesting is, as that need subsided, there's companies that have embraced that lesson, if you will, and just adopted it and kept it as their working culture. And then there's companies that have fallen back into the warm embrace of, no, we can just be in the status. But that's a full sense of security. You might not have that external factor that is demanding agility of you right this moment, but it's coming. So yeah, it's interesting. Those are the ones we talked about. Is there any others that come to mind?

Ben - 00:24:02: Leadership. I know that when we talk about leadership, we're always talking about influence, right? And we're always talking about vision. No one ever says, hey, when you're a leader, don't be in that crystal palace in the sky and not be available. Be available. Basic. Be available. Be self-aware. Be self-aware of who you are, decisions, what you represent. I wish that companies all had like a leadership course and they said, be self-aware, self-maintain, be available. A lot of times, and then what we never talk about is developing relationships all the way down. I'm not saying be everybody's friend. And what I'm saying is, you develop relationships, you develop loyalty. And loyalty is something we're missing in this day and age, right? People want to jump all over the different companies for whatever reasons. But that old school 1980s sense of loyalty isn't there anymore, right? I have a buddy that works at, that we used to work at Papa John's, right? And then when Papa was in charge, he was the CEO, they would do anything for him, right? Like to this day, they said, hey, if he came back, I would go back. So why is loyalty important? One, you develop your personnel, right? Then they become SMEs. And then you have this huge knowledge pool, right? It's just cascading effects like that. So be available, be personal, have relationships. It goes a long way. Do simple things. Like if we get all this swag as leaders, I'll write personal notes and I'll send them to my field engineers. I'll get a ball cap and I know which of us need ball caps and I'll send some. And it's little things like that. And then one more piece of thing, what I wanted to share is that a lot of the times when you do that, it's long lasting and it's memorable. I remember my dad used to work at a New York Life insurance company. And his boss would, every year for my birthday, would send me a $2 bill. Was I looking? So every year at my birthday, besides looking for presents, I'm looking for that $2 bill. And those little things like that are lasting and impacting. Build loyalty, build relationships, and be available.

Sarah - 00:26:16: Yeah, that's really good advice. Okay, so here's a hard question for you. When or how do you know you've mastered the basics enough to progress or innovate in that area, to take on a new initiative, et cetera? Like, are there measures of success? How do you know that you're doing a good job of being brilliant on the basics enough to build upon it?

Ben - 00:26:43: So another good question. I believe they're lag indicators, right? And you're going to get to a point where you have your great in brilliant on the basics, and then your customer experience is great. And then you reach this spot called Arte. Right. And then once you reach that, that's the mastery of everything. But the problem is personnel changes, process changes, and then you're bringing all the basics, meters are going to go down. It's kind of like an ebb and flow, just like the tide. So it's constant work in progress. And do you master it? No. I'm sure with myself, if I'm wearing a white shirt, do I have a mastery of going out to eat and not standing in my white shirt? No, I'm going to stand up. I don't know, two out of seven times, 83, right? So it's constant. You're constantly doing it. It's part of your constant daily grind. I don't believe there's a real mastery of it, but I do believe that you'll get to a point where the change part, the willingness to change, look at your processes, wanting to keep building on your future.

Sarah - 00:27:49: Yeah. Makes sense. And I think I like the way you said that because I think it calls to light the distinction of your phrase, which was be brilliant at the basics versus probably the more common verbiage, which is master the basics, right? So the goal is not to master because that's aiming for perfection, which isn't possible. And it's a moving target, right? But it's the idea of making sure that you're brilliant at the basics as what is required evolves.

Ben - 00:28:19: It's a total moving target.

Sarah - 00:28:21: Yeah. Okay. So when you think about building upon the brilliant basics at 3D, what do you think about? Like what is on your mind in terms of future opportunities, what's next, you know, what you're working toward?

Ben - 00:28:41: So when I respect 3D and my guys and I've told them in this topic of building on basics. Relationships, right? I will go out to customer sites. I tell them, I tell my team, we want to be part of your team. We want to be fully integrated. It touches on our strategic alignment. It touches on our communications with customers, the relationship part, and the leadership I shared with you. We want to be fully integrated and be part of your team. We want them to feel, hey, I know your boss is part of our team too. And so I'm part of their team. And obviously you have insight. I want them to grow so we can grow, which is basically everybody listening wants their customers to grow so we can grow, right? And so total team effort. That's the level of relationship you need. And you can't get that with generic emails, text, or you have to go down to the ground level and develop those relationships.

Sarah - 00:29:45: Yeah.

Ben - 00:29:45: That's what I want.

Sarah - 00:29:47: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that's the opportunities for innovation come from, right? I mean, you're only going to learn what's important to the next phases of your business from the people you're delivering it to.

Ben - 00:29:57: Great point. Great point. If you don't have receptors to listen, it's not that ground low we can't listen. And then you can say, hey, you know what? We have a product for you for that. We have material for you so that we can help. You can't do that if you don't have that relationship. You're not part of the team.

Sarah - 00:30:15: Right.

Ben - 00:30:15: And you hide behind the screen.

Sarah - 00:30:17: Yeah, for sure. This was a great conversation, Ben. Any closing thoughts, final words of wisdom?

Ben - 00:30:25: Thank you for inviting me. I think that it's just an important reminder to tell our leaders and visionaries out there, we all have great ideas. We all have probably some process that's going to change everything. But it's just, I'm glad we just took the opportunity to just remember that it's brilliant on the basics thing. It's right under your nose. Go ahead and look under the cart, look under the rug, see what we got, look around, look in your own house, make sure we're operating the way we need to before we start decorating, basically.

Sarah - 00:30:56: Yeah.

Ben - 00:30:57: And I appreciate that.

Sarah - 00:30:58: Yeah, no, I'm glad you came. And I think it is a good reminder. It's also important to understand, like it's not either or, right? So people that are visionary and they're innovative and they're thinking about what's next, that's great. I mean, you have to be doing that. You also need to make sure that before you take that next step. These things we talked about today are in tip-top shape. So thanks for coming on.

Ben - 00:31:23: I enjoyed it. Thank you.

Sarah - 00:31:24: Yes. You can find more by visiting the home of UNSCRIPTED at futureoffieldservice.com. The podcast is published in partnership with IFS. You can learn more at ifs.com. As always, thank you for listening.

Episode 284

In this episode of the Unscripted Podcast, host Sarah Nicastro gives an update on the upcoming announcement of the Future of Field Service Stand Out 50 leadership awards, a look into plans for Future of Field Service x IFS Unleashed, and a heads up on upcoming research to watch for.
If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe, rate, and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.

Episode Highlights:

Sarah - 00:00:00:

I just wanted to take the opportunity to fill you in on some of the things that are coming up and to make sure that you know to keep an eye out for the Standout 50 announcement and to hopefully help us in celebrating and acknowledging the hard work that service leaders do and the impact that they're having on so many. And that's true not only of the 50 that we worked hard to select, but everyone that was nominated and even those who were not.

Welcome to the UNSCRIPTED Podcast. I'm your host, Sarah Nicastro. Actually, today I'm also the guest or just doing a solo episode. I wanted to record a quick solo. I realize it's been quite a while since I've done so, and there's been some exciting things that myself and the team have been working on, and I thought it would be good to just give our listeners a little bit of an update on some of the things that will be coming up for you to keep an eye out for and just share some of the things that we've been hard at work at that we're really excited about. So for those of you that follow along regularly, you'll know that for the past few years, we've been doing the Future of Field Service live tour. This year, we have had or will have three events. We did our first event in Stockholm, our second event in Cologne, Germany, and we are gearing up for our third event, which will be very different from the others, but I think a whole lot of fun. So we are actually doing sort of an event within the event at IFS Unleashed, which is IFS's global conference taking place in Orlando, October 14th through the 18th at the Marriott World Center. So Future of Field Service has some of its own content and networking opportunities and things like that taking place throughout the week. So we'll be recording two live podcasts on site that you will get to listen to and be able to keep an eye out for. We're hosting three drop-in clinics. So sort of a bit like a roundtable where we're picking certain topics and having a working conversation around those topics in a way that the folks participating can leave with hopefully some good perspective and some actionable insights. And probably the thing I'm most excited for is on October, 17th at the event, we will officially announce the Future of Field Service Standout 50. So hopefully some of you have seen the information on that. It's something that we were promoting at the beginning of summer. So it is a way to acknowledge the hard work and impact service leaders are having within their businesses or their teams, their customers, their companies, and the industry at large. So we had a nomination period where anyone could nominate a leader that they work for, work with, know, etc. And myself, along with Dot Mynahan, who was with Otis Elevator for more than 30 years, running field service, John Carroll, who leads the service council community, and then Dr. Tim Baines, who is the executive director of the advanced services group at Aston Business School. The four of us served as the judges for the awards. So we went through all of the nominations and landed on the top 50. So the Standout 50. And that list will be announced on October 17th live at IFS Unleashed. And some of the folks will be with us in person. Others won't. That'll really just be the official announcement of that list. And then we have a variety of things planned after to recognize and acknowledge those 50 leaders and celebrate the impact that they've had on their teams, their peers, their companies, and the industry. I'm really excited that's coming up. One of the other big projects that we've been doing with, or alongside the Standout 50, is a research report that we will be publishing around the same time. So what we wanted to do is take the opportunity to pick the brains, if you will, of these 50 leaders who have been nominated and selected to represent stellar leadership in service and understand what is on their minds. So when we were thinking about what would we want to ask and how would we want to structure a research piece, I kept coming back in my mind to, you know, when I'm interviewing people. And they talk about sort of these different pillars of what's important to them in service leadership. There's the people, process, technology trifecta that is commonly referred to. So we decided to structure the survey that way. So we have a set of questions around people, process, and technology, and getting their perspective on what is important in each of those categories, a pulse check, if you will, on where they are at in topics that relate to those categories and where their businesses are at, and also taking a look ahead at some of the trends that are top of mind or innovations that are top of mind for them. So we will be alongside announcing the Standout 50. We will be able to share this report that really captures their perspective at this time on what is important. What are the challenges? What are the opportunities? What do they foresee in the future? And use that as a way to share some of their knowledge with our broader audience. I'm really excited for that as well. And that's something that you will be able to find on futurefieldservice.com when it is published. And of course, we'll share. I am personally also very excited for IFS Unleashed. So while we will be doing some of our own content at our event within the event, I will, of course, also be partaking in all of the IFS content and activities throughout the week as well. So there's a great agenda in place. The thing that I'm most excited for is eight-time Olympic sprinter Usain Bolt is giving a keynote. And I'm really excited to hear what he has to say at the IFS Unleashed event in 2022, was it? No, 23. Last year. I can't keep track. The last one that happened, Michael Phelps spoke, and I found his interview so impactful. So I'm really excited for that session. Gary Player, famous golfer, will also be there. And the MIT Center for Information Systems Research is doing an AI readiness program, which I think will be really insightful and helpful for folks that are attending. So I'm excited for that as well. And then perhaps most exciting of all, we are taking the opportunity, since I will be in Orlando, to take the kids to Disney. Eric, Evan, and Ellis are flying down after the event to gear up for some fun and go to Disney. We will be there for Ellis' eighth birthday, which he's excited for. But he has also told me that he is happy we'll be at Disney, but he still wants to have a birthday party when we come home. So I'm pulling double duty on that. But I'm excited to have a week of hard work and a lot of engagement with the Future of Field Service community, with the IFS customer base, and then finish it off with my family coming to join me and having some fun. So it'll be the best of both worlds. So I just wanted to take the opportunity to fill you in on some of the things that are coming up and to make sure that you know to keep an eye out for the Standout 50 announcement and to hopefully help us in celebrating and acknowledging the hard work that service leaders do and the impact that they're having on so many. And that's true, not only of the 50 that we worked hard to select, but everyone that was nominated and even those who were not. I hope you'll keep an eye out for that and also for the research piece that we'll be doing alongside so that you can really think about what's top of mind for these folks and how that compares with what's going on in your brains and in your organizations and in your industries, etc. So if you want to have a look at the IFS Unleashed agenda and just get an idea of what's going on there, if it's something that you might be interested in participating in, you can do that at ifsunleashed.com. Otherwise, the Standout 50 announcement, the Standout 50 research piece will both be available in due time on futureoffieldservice.com. And of course, in the background of all of the exciting work around those initiatives, we are continuing to crank out our weekly articles and this weekly podcast. So those will keep coming as well. As far as UNSCRIPTED goes, you've found us if you're listening to this, which is wonderful. But you can always find the episodes on futureoffieldservice.com. You can also find the video versions on YouTube. And then if you regularly use Apple or Spotify, you can find and subscribe to the podcast there as well so that you don't miss anything. So a lot of fun and exciting things going on. A lot of really good insights and information that will be coming out to our community in the late October timeframe. So I look forward to bringing that all to you and keeping our regularly scheduled programming going in the meantime. I hope you're all well and stay tuned for more soon. You can find anything you need and all the ways to get in touch at futureoffieldservice.com. The podcast is published in partnership with IFS. You can learn more at ifs.com. As always, thank you for listening.

A couple of weeks ago I welcomed to the UNSCRIPTED podcast Tim Spencer, VP of North American Operations at Interblock Gaming for what turned out to be one of my favorite conversations to date. Tim is well known in the field service space for the work he’s done innovating within the service function at companies like BUNN, Scientific Games, WMS Gaming, ACCO Brands and Taylor.

What I’ve always appreciated about Tim is that he stands out from many of his peers – older, tenured leaders – in that he has little interest in the status quo. I’ve watched many of his peers speak on stages and belabor the challenges of actually innovating or defend their decisions to continue “doing what’s working” in a variety of areas while Tim gives insights on embracing new technologies, modernizing the talent approach, and finding new ways to meet today’s customer demands.

So, I was excited to welcome him onto the podcast to discuss what, in his view, enables a long-time leader to avoid falling into the warm embrace of the familiar and instead push ahead to continue to evolve. Within our discussion, Tim humbly shared his views on what aspects of service and leadership have stayed the same over his career, what’s changed, and how he’s worked to remain relevant and impactful over his long career.

Valuing What is Timeless

Tim’s insight can be roughly divided into two categories: knowing and valuing what is timeless and keeping pace with change (as a leader and for your business). Number one in the timeless category is the criticality of good communication. “One of the keys to success in service is communication. Always has been. Always will be. Won't ever change,” he emphasizes. “I’ve found that in my career, every challenge I ever had with a customer was resolved one of two ways. Either by better understanding expectations or by better communicating. Or both. So, if I learned what they expected and they learned what I could deliver, we aligned those expectations.”

Effective communication is a building block of any relationship, and the importance of being able to build and nurture relationships is the second timeless skill. “Generally, this effective communication helped to build a good relationship. If the relationship came off the rails, it was because we didn't spend the time we needed on the communication,” says Tim. “And the keys here are timeliness and candor. Again, I've rarely had a customer who said, I hate the bad news you're giving me. Usually what they say is, why didn't you tell me sooner? Maybe I could have reacted. We could have worked something out. We could have done something differently. Timely and honest communication are crucial.”

Customer centricity came up next, and not only in the sense of creating customer intimacy but for obtaining insights to fuel innovation. “When I was very young in my career, the President of our company put me in a sales leadership role for two years to develop my understanding of our customers,” shares Tim. “So, first sales call ever, the customer says, ‘oh boy, another new guy. What are you going to do for me?’ I said, well, I don't know. What do you need? And he said, ‘No salesperson's ever asked me that. They’ve always said, here's what I'm selling.’ That was something I've incorporated since that moment, is to ask my customers, what do you need? What do you need me to do? How can I help you grow your business? How can I change to help you be better? That informs and fuels whatever you need to do next to be successful.”

Tim also shared about the timeless value of learning, especially from peers. “As a leader, if you're not finding a way to reach out to other people and learn and grow by association, you're missing the boat and you're doing yourselves and your customers and your employees a disservice,” he says. “Finding ways to tap into the ideas and thinking of others is a great source of new ideas, valuable connections, and inspiration for innovation.”

Keeping Pace with Change

It might not surprise you that one of the things that’s changed most since Tim’s career began is the use and role of technology in service – and he hasn’t shied away from rolling up his sleeves to understand what’s available, its impact, and to put to good use technology to modernize service in many of the organizations he’s led. “One of most obvious changes over my career is technology,” Tim says. “You know, you think about your grandparents and wonder what changes they saw in technology over time. Well, I'm now one of those grandparents! I spoke about the innovative launch of our first handheld device back in the early 2000s and that was nothing compared to where technology is today.”

With the volume of technological innovation Tim has witnessed, I was curious how he prompted himself to keep pace and determine what investments were best at different points throughout his journey. “I never implemented any technology in any of my roles just for the sake of technology; I did it because I wanted to solve a business problem,” he shares. “I had an issue. I had to solve it. And I looked to others and experts and technology to try to figure it out. Find a solution and try and implement it in my business to make it better. Then you could innovate or iterate on that, innovate and iterate again, or find the next business problem and go find a solution to that. So just always being on the hunt, I guess, for the next problem to solve. Not being complacent, saying, I don't have any problems because that's stupid. Everyone's got a business problem somewhere.”

We also discussed the evolution of the role of service within the business – it’s shift from cost center to profit center and everything that shift has brought about. “I mentioned that I cut my teeth in the manufacturing side of the business. Product companies for a long time made all their money on the product, skinny margins, and gave away the service. And most companies now have figured out that the inverse is actually the key to success. The margin opportunities are in service; the opportunity to really continue with a revenue model that's repetitive, that's on the service side. That's something that's changed a lot over the many, many years that I've been slugging away at it,” Tim reflects.

The one area that Tim and I debated a bit is just how much has changed – or not – when it comes to leadership styles. “I thought about your question on leadership a lot and at first thought, I don't think leadership styles have really changed or evolved. Then I thought, and I thought, and I thought, and finally I said, well, maybe they have,” he says.

What we ended up coming around to is that Tim has naturally inclined toward a leadership style that is being demanded more in today’s landscape. So, while it hasn’t changed for him, we uncovered in our conversation that it has indeed evolved as a whole.

There are elements of leadership, of course, that have been and always will be foundationally important. “The things that haven't changed relative to how we lead, are things like fairness, equity, and honesty. And one I'll throw out there that many people might not agree with, but I really love, which is inclusiveness. I've never been the smartest guy in the room. I've never been the expert, but I know where to find those people, tap into their experience and knowledge, and have them be a part of the solution. Not only do I get a better solution, but I get a team that's excited to participate. So, I think that leadership style never changes,” he says.

When it comes to what has evolved, it is tied to the elements of leadership I see as outdated like control, ego, and even fear. “What I came to think about that might be a change is the ability to adapt your style beyond the very ‘command and control’ kind of leadership,” says Tim. “I remember an early encounter when I was a supervisor at a plant with an executive who said, ‘I don’t get ulcers, I give them.’ I thought, Wow. Okay. That's aggressive. And throughout the early years of my career, I had a lot of leaders like that who would often say to me, ‘you know, you're not mean enough. You're not tough enough. You're not kicking butts.’ But that's never been my style.”

While that’s a testament to Tim and not only his values but his ability to recognize an approach that’s ultimately more effective, it’s a positive change that “his style” is becoming more the norm. “I think that finally that style has found its home. In our current environment – our employment environment, our work environment, our leadership environment - it's okay to have a little bit softer, gentler approach to leadership,” he reflects. “It doesn't mean that you aren't still tough, that you don't follow guidelines, metrics, and principles to hold people accountable. But it does mean that you can still find joy in the process. You can have some camaraderie and good spirit and mentorship and an approach to leadership that understands and appreciates that your people have lives. If we think about our employees' environment, we can adapt and change ourselves to make it a much better, sweeter work environment for them. And a place that they'll want to come back to the next day and a place they'll want to maybe work harder for.”

The evolution of leadership style ties in, at least in part, with the rapidly evolving talent landscape – and the two topics are inextricably linked. “Today, there’s more of a need to do the right thing. Then it was the right thing, to do the right thing. Now you need to do the right thing in order to attract the workers that you need. And if you're not thinking creatively about ways to make their work-life balance better or to appeal to whatever it is that floats their boat, someone else who's more innovative is going to get the talent,” Tim cautions. “You're either going to not get enough people or you'll get the less talented. So, I think innovation relative to our approach to work, our approach to our people, our approach to hiring and retention, innovation is the key. You've got to be thoughtful. You've got to think outside the box. You've got to be smarter than the other guy who's recruiting the same people. You've got to be thoughtful about what does the employee need in their current environment and what can I do as a company leader to try and help solve for that need.”

Managing Vs. Leading

In Tim’s view, part of the role of leadership is to look for the opportunities to change. “I used to tell young managers that there's a difference between a manager and a leader. A manager manages the process and doesn't change anything. A leader looks for ways to change the process. And I always encourage them to be more leaders than managers,” he says. “What I tried to do in my career was to always be thinking, okay, this feels pretty good, but what am I missing? What's next? And where's the next opportunity to change something? Because not changing is backward movement in life. Staying put is the same as moving backwards.”

Leading well relies on two important factors: one’s willingness to keep learning and one’s ability to be kind. “You can never stop learning and growing, no matter where you are in your career. As part of that learning and growing, look for ways to innovate and then iterate,” Tim says. “Lastly, I'm convinced after 35-plus years, a kind leader can and will prosper. Don't think that you can't be a kind and caring leader. Don't think that you have to be the guy that's kicking rear ends down the hallway. We need to find joy in our leadership. Other people need to find joy in our leadership, and have it not be a burden to work for us. There are ways to do that and still accomplish the mission of the job.”

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